Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade with Chris Gethard

[00:00:02] You have podcasted poorly. That's good. Right? I do want to just, I want to highlight two interesting taglines for this movie.

[00:00:33] One I really like, one I think is really stupid. Is Adventure still has a name or was that for last? I think that's the second one. So, the first one is terrible in my opinion. So bad, so funny that they did this. And this is the teaser poster that's just Indy, holding his whip. The man with the hat is back. Okay. And this time he's bringing his dad. I remember- It just sounds like a Macaulay Culkin movie. It does. It just sounds so stupid.

[00:00:59] I remember the man with the hat is back and I had flipped in my mind that that was for Temple and that- The man with the hat, Chris. The man with the hat is back. Look at this. The man with the hat is back. And this time he's bringing his dad. Like, I'm like, what do I care if he, like, that's exciting? His dad? Like, it's not inherently good news. First half is- First half, man with the hat is back. That's fine. It's a little- Iconic hat. Maybe the iconic hat. He's more than a hat. He's bringing his dad. Yeah, but he is a man with a hat. He was bringing his dad.

[00:01:26] He was recently on Connections, NYT Connections, things Indiana Jones like is associated with. Oh, I noticed that one. And it was like, hat, whip, bomber jacket. It was a fourth thing. Anyway, the other tagline I really liked. I just want to say about that poster. Yeah. Beautiful Drew Struzan painting. Really nice painting. Although I also think I prefer the main poster painting. Sure. Oh, well that one's incredible. Because it's so, like, nice looking. But you said like, oh, it's that tagline in Indy with the whip. You should make it clear that painting is like-

[00:01:55] That poster is like a Drew Struzan painting of Indiana Jones at like a Kmart photo studio. It is like a high school, like- Yeah. Head and shoulders turning to the camera, three quarter profile. I think they settled on a really nice tagline for the main poster, which is, have the adventure of your life keeping up with the Joneses. I think that's a clever way to do the family thing. Yeah. That's all. Here's what I'd say. This movie kind of needs no tagline. You just like put the poster out and you're like, here it is, the third Indiana Jones movie

[00:02:24] and Sean Connery is his dad. But that's why I think they're saying the dad thing because they're like, but the dad! You know, like, they want you to know about the dad. Sure. It's not just like a third Indiana Jones movie, which would probably be enough. Just like Indiana Jones, he's here. It is a little bit sad that they didn't come up with keeping up with the Joneses first. I think keeping up with the Joneses is just really clever. That was the second swing though. Yeah. You know, that shouldn't have been. No. Not only is it the second swing, but it's also like the second beat of the second swing.

[00:02:52] And here's a cool Japanese poster, which has River Phoenix on it. That's pretty cool. I think River Phoenix is so fucking good in this movie. And I love that sequence so fucking much. Well, we'll get right into it because it's the first sequence in the movie. I'm just going to get ahead of this, right? This is my favorite Indiana Jones movies. I've said it in other episodes. I know it is objectively not the best.

[00:03:18] I know that Raiders does basically everything this movie does better. They are so similar. And like similarly, I'm like, I can't argue that it's better than the opening Fertility Idol sequence of Raiders. But the River Phoenix sequence is my favorite Indiana Jones sequence, which is absurd to say when it doesn't have Harrison Ford in it. That is absurd. That's borderline absurd. Not saying it's the best. Not saying it's the best. I have so much fun watching it. It's really great. It's really great.

[00:03:48] It is really great. Last Crusade is my favorite, but it also I've I have really been thinking hard and I know I don't know if I'm supposed to jump in yet. I never know. I've never known. Absolutely. I did. This was I. I did briefly have to think I thought I was like, was this the first movie my dad ever took me to see in theater? 1989. How old would you have been? I was nine, but I realized it wasn't. I was a little old for you. Some of the first movies.

[00:04:14] I actually it made me research the first movies I ever saw in the theater and the first movie I believe I saw in the theater is actually really, really to me quite funny. Which was that I started breaking down the earliest movies. I remember it was like this and American tale. Yeah. Home alone and Batman. Right. But these are all 89, 90, 91 like that year. Then there was an early outlier, which is that my dad clearly had no one to go with and did bring me to see Star Trek for. Oh, yeah.

[00:04:44] That's a great movie. But for a six year old. Yeah. For a six for a six year old. That first experience in the movie is the fourth sequel. Well, sure. Story wise. But you know what? It's fun because it's like they're in. Well, out of fish out of water and there's the whales. It's a pretty gentle movie. It is maybe the Star Trek movie that is most accessible to a six year old with zero contact context, which is like space people in modern day San Francisco being confused by like cabs and shit and then giant flying.

[00:05:13] It does have like almost police academy style. Yeah, it does. And it's an animal. A really well executed version of that, too. It's like I would. I do. I will say, though, all of these things. I love your defense of it. But I have a feeling that if I sat my father down and said, why is the first movie I ever saw in the theater Star Trek for? He'd be like, I didn't want to go. It was that or right sitting by myself in a way that would have made me sad. Right. Right. Do you remember liking it? I remember liking the experience of seeing a movie. Right.

[00:05:42] Indiana Jones. The part of why I felt like Last Crusade might have been the first movie I ever saw was I was like, I do have those sense memories. And I'm so glad to get to talk about them here where I'm like, this is perhaps the movie more than Raiders for me because of the theater experience. Like this is the movie that makes me feel how you want movies to make you feel my thing with it. I'm like, I know Raiders is better. And I watch Raiders more because I'm like, I want to study this.

[00:06:11] It is such a miracle of like construction and craft. And yet I just have so much fun watching this. And I'm like, this is a perfect example of like what I want out of just like fun, well made popcorn. Well performed. I like this movie a lot. Chris, though, you had some thought. I feel like you were completing. I can't. Maybe not. Just the idea of like this will always be my favorite Indiana Jones because I saw it in the theater.

[00:06:36] I also have such a I'm 95 percent certain it was attached to this movie that because this was 1989. I started reading comic books around 1987, 88. And I have a very distinct memory that someone might correct me. Lord knows your fans will be the first ones to tell me if I'm right or wrong. No idea what you're talking about. Our Sweetie Pie fans. I love your fans. I love them. Famously. I also want to say it's nice too because a lot of other times I've been on there's been natural segues into Star Wars stuff.

[00:07:02] And I get I know your fans don't think I talk about Star Wars too much, but I don't really see too many connections between this movie and Star Wars. Oh, between the George Lucas produced film, the Indiana Jones. No, like for this one, I feel like we could just keep it separate. Couldn't be further apart. It's a streamlined episode. Hey! As the offspring told us. Just so they have the same star. Gotta keep them separated. Colonel Veer's stunning performance as Walter Donovan in this one. I love that guy. But I do remember seeing a trailer for the Matt Salinger Captain America that I think was before this movie. That lines up. Because that's...

[00:07:32] I've heard a lot of people talk about that. That's a 1990 film, so that would have been appropriate. The Captain America shield came up and a few nerds in the theater flipped out. But this was an era in my life where I had been reading comics for two years in isolation. And all of a sudden... Oh, so you were like, oh, there are others like me. I'm in a room with people who like being... Yeah. Although I feel like that was like a nadir for comic book Captain America. Like late 80s, he was very uncool. X-Men had become so cool.

[00:08:02] Yeah. Like the Avengers were kind of not that cool. Is that like Nomad era or is Nomad about to happen? It's probably around there. Nomad might be earlier. We are in the very fascinating 10 year plus run by Mark Grunewald, which I've made... Which has the best Captain America's ever been and also some of the most inexplicably atrociously bad writing you've ever seen in a comic book. I should do a deeper... I've never really read Cap in like a sort of thoughtful way. Well, because you're not a patriot. Right. I just am not a patriot.

[00:08:30] No, it's because I'm a US agent guy actually. I just love that guy. Hey, when you dive into the Mark Grunewald run of Captain America, you know who to text if you need to have him. I don't really like the conversation about it. He's... Yeah, it's funny. Like he... He's not someone like his rogues gallery. I'm not that familiar. I don't know. I loved obviously when Captain America got cool again when Ed Brubaker did him, right? When suddenly it was like, whoa, Captain America is like dark spy stuff. And this is so cool. I loved all that.

[00:08:57] I feel like I've heard a lot of folks of your generation talk about that experience of the Captain America trailer being pretty widely attached to Last Crusade in the same summer that Burton's Batman has just come out and feeling like, oh shit, it's all happening. Like if you've just seen Batman work and you see the Captain America teaser that's the shield, you have to think like, holy shit, they're all going to happen now. Every year, they're going to make all of them. They're all going to work with the public.

[00:09:24] And then it's like Captain America comes out, is like muddled with, is a nothing movie, disappears. Batman basically becomes the only superhero that works until the 2000s. We're also people, I think some... Younger people sometimes forget we are also now, not again, I don't want to dwell on it, but we're also now far enough away from Return of the Jedi that liking Star Wars is getting decidedly lame. Star Wars has become like cheesy kid shit, I feel like. Before the re-releases of the original trilogy.

[00:09:54] For sure. Actually, before the toys got cool again. Right, it's in its weird kind of swampy... I love what you're fucking setting up here. Right? I was going to correct you on the toys thing and the fact that you fucking got to it. The toys got cool, the re-releases happened, Star Wars got cool again, but we are in a stretch where liking, like wearing an X, like I liked the X-Men by this point, I would never wear an X-Men t-shirt to school. No. When I say the X-Men were cool, I mean they were cool in the sense of like they had become Marvel's biggest star, but obviously comic books remained... They were the coolest thing within comic books.

[00:10:24] And where, again, to tie into the culture too, let's not also forget Griffin, Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles is in the process of about to explode. Like nerd shit is about to hit and this movie... But it's got its own little quadrant, right? Like it's not like now where it's the main thing in culture. But yes, this movie... This movie made you feel good about being an unabashed fan. Yeah. For the first time in my... That cycle has always spun, but in my life cycle, being in that theater,

[00:10:52] hearing those people flip out, being there with my dad, I'm like, man, it's just the movie that probably more than any other imprinted in me the feeling of like, I want to sit here. I want to eat popcorn. I want it to be dark. I want everybody to be quiet. I also feel like... Generations of people molded by Spielberg giving you that beautiful feeling. 89 is a year that for better or worse starts to feel like the year that sets Hollywood on the course to where it is today.

[00:11:20] Like you look at the 89 blockbusters and you're like, this is a good slate, but also... Batman. The studios kind of become obsessed with chasing this lineup. They start chasing Dick Tracy almost immediately. Right, but it's like... The start of the Disney Renaissance. Because I believe Last Crusade, Batman, and Ghostbusters 2 all break opening weekend records. It's like the record gets broken like three times in one summer. Mm-hmm. You've brought this up many, many times. Next thing you know, everyone's having panic attacks in San Diego.

[00:11:50] Wait, I don't get it. Comic-Con. Comic-Con culture. Oh, sure, sure. Everything is spiraling out of control. This might be the snowball down the hill that leads to Comic-Con culture. I think it all kind of... You are not wrong. Yes. Next thing you know, you're on the sub one with someone just head to toe. I now have it. I can now read... Because you always say this and then I just am always like, I can't tell how to look this up. But here are the opening weekend records. It was held by Beverly Hills Cop 2 with $26 million opening weekend in 1987. Last Crusade beats that with a 29.

[00:12:20] Ghostbusters 2 then beats that with like 29.4, you know, like slightly higher. And then Batman does. And then Batman crushes that at the end of the year in 1989 with $40 million, which is then beaten by Batman Returns. Yeah. So it holds for like three years. Yep. And then Jurassic Park. Batman Forever beats Jurassic Park. People forget. 52 mil. And then Lost World beats Batman Forever. What do you think beat Lost World?

[00:12:46] People kind of forget about this because Spider-Man becomes the famous, the first movie to open over $100 million. Is it Sorcerer's Stone? Harry Potter. Yeah. Right. Because I remember people being like, is Harry Potter going to be the first movie with $100 million weekend? It's a little below. And it made like 94, 90. And people were like, you know what? I guess it's just mathematically impossible. There was no way to have that many show times, that many screens. You can't sell that many tickets. And then the following year, not even like six months later, Spider-Man does 114. And people were like, holy shit.

[00:13:16] Impossible. And then you get to like a decade plus later, Avengers Endgame does like 114 opening day. No, Avengers. Oh, Endgame did. Yeah, sure. It did 357. I wonder if that'll ever be beaten. I guess it will one day. But this movie did break the record, like you say, Griffin. And it does, it is a year of sequels and comic books and also like The Little Mermaid. So like that, you know, that element rising again, the cartoon, you know, movies.

[00:13:44] Yeah, it's a year of like, right. It's this is what we want the industry to be. But you also have Look Who's Talking, Dead Poets Society. You have non-franchise-y things. Like you have a big comedy. You have a big adult family drama. One of those becomes a franchise. Yeah. Dead Poets Society. Two, two, two dead, two poets. Yeah. Dead Poets Society, Tokyo Drift. Yeah. We can keep. Anyway. Look, this is Blank Check with Griffin and David. I'm Griffin. I'm David.

[00:14:12] It's a podcast about filmographies, directors who have massive success early on in their careers and are given a series of blank checks to make whatever crazy passion products they want. And sometimes those checks clear and sometimes they bounce. Baby. This is a mini series on the films of Steven Spielberg. First half of his career. And we're talking today about Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade. His third of four Indiana Jones movies. That he directed. Yep. That he directed. Yep. His third of his four.

[00:14:40] For many years, the fairly satisfying conclusion to the Indiana Jones series and now the middle entry in the Indiana Jones series. Yeah. Technically. It is weird to be like that is this is now the exact midpoint. And it's another thing where like you talk about that Star Wars dead zone. And I know that was a little before David and I's time, but I've dug into it a lot because I do think it's a fascinating thing that's basically been culturally forgotten, which is that like Star Wars just kind of goes away for 10 years. Yeah. And it's like a thing. It was dead on the vine. Right.

[00:15:10] It's like hardcore nerds are keeping it alive at a very low burn in a way that like books and everyone loves those Timothy Zahn books. Yeah. The Grand Admiral Thawne shit. And it's coming back in the in the Filoni verse. But it was a little. If you were reading those Timothy Zahn books. Yes. You were a dork. You were a loser. Because I would equate it to the period between original Star Trek and canceled in the movies. Right. Where you're like there's a small fervent group of people who are digging into the shit.

[00:15:35] But that period is shorter and that period is like it's like those people were cultivating a cult show. They were like we need to keep this cult show that didn't get that many viewers alive. Star Wars it's like these were the biggest movies in the world. They're just done. But the fans are like well we want more so we'll just sort of write. We'll read some books and we'll but like it was like you know Star Wars fandom was wide and thin and Star Trek fandom was like more concentrated and small.

[00:16:01] But the other part of it is that like you know Lucas very early on was like I'm going to do nine. Right. And then after Return of the Jedi people were like that's not fucking happening. And he so quickly does the two Ewok movies and is like and I'm doing two cartoon shows and droids and Ewoks and the Ewok movies all kind of don't really hit in the way I think he hoped like. And we try as someone who was alive then like the Ewok movies. You try. We watched them. Yeah. We were ready. Yeah. We were confused. Right. We knew what they were.

[00:16:30] Only fair that you were confused. Yeah. To give you a sense like and this will age me everyone will know that I am truly an Xennial that this this micro generation the. Yep. Yeah. The Oregon Trail generation as some of the we're called the Xennials we had Apple to ease with Oregon Trail in our classrooms. Here's what it meant to be a Star Wars fan is that I was on a pre worldwide web internet where you would dial in from your computer to individual BBSs.

[00:16:56] And when I tell you there was one that I found in Whippany New Jersey that had an archive of Star Wars fan art that you could spend hours downloading on 2400. Probably would take hours. It would take a 2400 K modem but like oh someone drew a picture of an AT AT Walker and you can dial this BBS and download it because someone's making fan art like the level of loser dim that

[00:17:21] I just described that I actively participated in and was that kid of like I like Star Wars saw I have a floppy disk of fan art that I'm downloading from a BBS in Whippany New Jersey. Like that's where we were at this idea that that that every store was going to be stocked with lightsabers that there would be an entire theme park to go get lost in the immersive experience of this.

[00:17:44] No, you're using your computer to sit for hours communicating with another computer computer in Whippany New Jersey. That's what you have to do. You have talked to me about and not said with sadness just kind of an objective reality that when you were starting out at the UCB theater you were like the cheat code is if you make a Star Wars reference everyone in the theater will last. Especially when you were on the road doing college shows.

[00:18:11] Because you're just like the people who come to improv shows are the exact people who have this knowledge base in their head and they don't hear other people say it out loud. And you even look at early Conan O'Brien and there's a similar thing of them making jokes about deep cut Star Wars characters which is like they know their audience. They're going to pop if they hear Lobot or Bosk, right? And you're like now if you say that people are like yeah, Bosk is at Walmart. Everybody, my kid knows who Bosk is already. Everyone knows who Bosk is already. My five year old son is a Bosk kid. Your kid's going to know about Bosk.

[00:18:40] I don't, I actively also, I just want to say I did not come here to talk about Star Wars. Of course not, we're not talking about Star Wars. I had a real firm intent to not dwell too much on Star Wars. Great. So just understand that this is a cultural discussion about the impact of 1989 that I did not lead everybody. Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade. When you're seeing this in theaters, Chris. Let's say our guest today. Oh, sorry. Go ahead. I didn't realize we hadn't introduced him. These blankies know who the fuck I am. I'm the bad boy of Blank Check. They forgot about Chris.

[00:19:10] The bad boy of Blank Check. This is Def Blank Check Jam. Hamburger. I ain't scared of you motherfuckers. I just did a show with Hamburger. Really? A month ago, I did a show with the real Alonzo Hamburger Jones. Holy shit. In New Jersey. I got a text from a club booker that was like, hey, if you're free tonight, we're just doing a show, a bunch of people dropping in. Hamburger's gonna be here. I was like in the car before I could even hit reply. Wait, this is incredible. How did he do?

[00:19:40] Of course. He had a fucking cowboy hat and he said the word hamburger. I mean, that's how he did. It's like, it's like Hanson. I'm like, they better play Mbop. I'm like, I got what I wanted. The whole thing is he says hamburger instead of swear words. Instead of swear words. But it's almost become like an OCD compulsion. Like he'll hit a punchline and then in between the setup is next joke. He'll be like, and here's the punchline in the rhythm hamburger. And here's the setup for the next one. It started out like curse words and now it's become like the Smurf saying Smurf.

[00:20:09] It's yeah, it's wild though. But he also was I'm not making fun of him. Hamburger was fucking great. He's been doing it forever. But it was also fun because it was a bunch of very young New Jersey comics in the green room and hamburger who predates me by many, many years. But then I walked in and was like, everyone's just sitting quietly, not talking to hamburger. I'm going to sit down and ask hamburger some questions. And then the whole room gathered up and showed their respect and listened to the stories of Alonzo Hamburger Jones. That fucking rules. Hamburger.

[00:20:39] Chris Gathard. Yes. You did our live show last year for the ninth anniversary. I think that was the last my presence has been felt on blank check. This is true. And you made a bit about you guys are afraid to have me back on, which you always think you'll make the joke publicly. And then you'll text me and you'll be like, I get it. If you guys don't want the heat, I don't take it personally episode. Yes. Yeah. Now, it is kind of crazy that it's been five spread out over 10 years. But I also think you're a high impact guest. We want the right pairing.

[00:21:06] You text me four times a year and you were haranguing us about this right before the record. When are you guys doing Kurosawa? When are you doing a Kiru? That's the episode I want. You walked in here today and you went, you guys call yourself a movie podcast. Isn't this supposed to be a movie podcast? No. Where's Kurosawa? I'll pull back the curtain. Pull back the curtain. Edit it out if you have to. I said, when are you guys doing Kurosawa? David Sims' response was, that's just so many movies. And I went, is this not a movie podcast? It's just a funny rejoinder. Is that not the goal? No, correct?

[00:21:36] It would take half a year. It would take half a year. For us to do Kurosawa. You don't have to do all. I mean, that's the whole fucking thing that we do. In this format, the only work around is we split it in half, which is what we did with Spielberg. We did half of Spielberg seven years ago. And now we're only finally getting around to the first half. I do get that. Like you're not scrambling to watch a six hour long reinterpretation of Hamlet. It's King Lear. In his, is it King Lear? In his color fit. I get it. It rips. The movie's good. But do the people not want to hear you guys talk about fucking Yojimbo?

[00:22:05] Am I crazy here that they don't want to hear Europeans on this? I think they enjoy it. I think it's an aspiration. Yeah. I think there's a certain level of people, person. But I just do want to say, I oftentimes have texted you guys like, hey, if you can't have me back, I get it. And I just need to be clear. I'm not ever setting out to make your fans furious. Of course not. I don't want to. You're the nice guy of podcasting. I'm not trying to get people mad. But if they get mad to a degree where I find it funny and unreasonable, I will at that point be the heel. You did a bit at our live show where you played into that and played the heel.

[00:22:35] And my manager, who I don't think has ever listened to an episode of the podcast, texted me and said that angry nerd was hilarious. Where did you find him? Look at that. Where did you find him, Griffin? But this is when I was someone shepherding you in your early career. This is how bad things have gotten for Chris. This is wild. Where did you, Griffin, discover Gether? This is what's wild to me is the amount of time she's had to hear me talk about you. They don't even know these people. It's if I remain on the frame. When I was like, that's Chris Gethard. And she was like, oh, people.

[00:23:04] It's not like she doesn't know who Chris Gethard is, but it was like connected for her. I get it. I think also you came in, started speaking from the crowd, started riling people up. We maybe never properly introduced you because everyone was like, we know who the fuck this is. Also, the way you asked me to do that show was we're doing this thing at Town Hall. Can you come do the Gethard thing? Right. Come like essentially. Play full heel. Be a full like fucking New World Order. Can I just say one quick thing?

[00:23:32] And I'm not apologizing. We talked a lot about Spider-Man 2 on the Spider-Man 2 episode. I think we talked about it. I don't. Did my bit miss? Maybe. There are people where I've read their opinions that they were looking forward to that episode and felt let down by it. And I feel very sad about that because it's one of my favorite movies. That episode's good. I mean, there are. I had. When I read. If there's a problem. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Right. When I read some people on the Blank Check subreddit going, this guy, his show got canceled

[00:24:02] and he's been cut from every movie and I'm happy. I go, maybe there's something to be said for the culture of Reddit and fandom and where they cross over that some of you could do some soul searching. I'm not setting out to piss everybody off. No, I agree with you. And this is why I'm bringing all of this up. This is why I'm bringing all this up. At the end of your bit, you walk off stage and we had a moment of genuine, earnest reflection in which we just called out, this whole podcast doesn't happen without you. Right. We used to watch your show. We were obsessed with you. You know, exactly.

[00:24:31] But I mean, yeah, it's like basically David and I bond over the ritual of the Gethershow every week. David wrote a very nice review and I believe you interviewed him about that review for the Gethershow. No, Alyssa, who saw both of us being really active in the community was like, you guys should be friends. But also I meet fucking Hosley because Creek in the Cave hires him to take over as producer of all of their podcasts, but specifically Talkin' TCGS, which Riley and I were already doing. He comes in midstream.

[00:24:58] There was a stretch where that podcast was, I think, getting as many listens as the show was getting views. Correct. It maybe even started to at times threaten it. We were like, we can't have the podcast analyzing the show. There was a more popular TV show. That's a bad sign of this show's future. What was the platform the episodes used to be on? Do you remember there was the website where they would go, like the archived episodes before you were uploading them to YouTube? What was that called? What was that called? Blink TV? I think so. Blip TV?

[00:25:28] Blip TV. Blip TV. Blip.TV. Blip.TV. What I remember is reporting to you- Imagine if the Gethershow existed when Twitch and Discord were- Insane. I mean, it's a different world. You're slugging it out on Blip.TV! Blip.TV! Yeah. I remember telling you how the first episode of the podcast talking about the show had done. And you said, that's more listens than Blip.TV reports we get per episode.

[00:25:53] And it forced you to look under the head and be like, is Blip.TV's algorithm wrong? Like, do they not know how to actually measure- And hey, turns out I was wrong if we see everything that's happened with Blip.TV since then. My paranoia was incorrect. I should have trusted in Blip.TV. Blip.TV. But this is- Was. You always love a Wikipedia entry in the search of was. 10 years of Blank Check. A decade of dreams. It feels very important to have you back on it for a movie that's so sized- You're getting them mad at me right now because they're going just talk about Last Crusade, guys. Why do all the Gethard episodes have these long ones?

[00:26:23] I'm actually getting mad. Let's talk about Indiana Jones and the Lassers. I'm trying to- And David's famously not in a movie today. It's me. It's me. It's me. I'm being a really good boy. He's being a great boy. I think we're mirroring the movie in that we're starting off the episode by talking about the early days. Absolutely. But now we're going to swing into talking about the subject. Right. Geth, tell me about your relationship with Indiana Jones up until the point of seeing this movie. Had you seen the others? The first one I see is Last Crusade in the theater. Wow. Yeah.

[00:26:48] The second one I see is that my parents used to take me, there was a campground called Otter Lake. It's still there. It's in the Poconos. North Jersey. That's a good cheap vacation. Go camping at a campground in the Poconos. This campground is one of these places that has a camp store. That's the first place I ever bought comic books. They also did movie nights. And I see Raiders. I see Raiders as part. It's screened at a campground in like a little outdoor pavilion, which is a really beautiful

[00:27:18] way to see Raiders. In your memory, is it a print? Are they like showing a print or are they like projecting a VHS? It's a VHS. It's a VHS. I would be shocked if they had. No, they weren't. They didn't have a projector out there. We went to very different summer camps. This is true. This is true. I'm not going to deny that. It's the old days. Touching on things that make listeners angry. I'm not going to deny that. All right. My parents were like, where's the cheapest place we can go? These people probably like literally prop up a big screen TV. No, it was not a screen.

[00:27:47] They would project DVDs at my summer camp. But I do feel like there was a weird culture. It's the only reason I asked the follow up question. There was a weird culture of like 16 millimeter prints existing of blockbuster movies that were basically just for like Boy Scouts. Yeah, I wouldn't be shocked. Like church showing. In my memory, it wasn't like I want to tell you that I can still hear like the crickets and smell campfires and hear the like of the film starting. I wish I could. Probably a VHS. Probably a VHS.

[00:28:15] But I would argue crusade in the theater and then double back to Raiders of the Lost Ark with your parents at a summer camp surrounded by other kids. This is the stuff of childhood dreams. That's an 80s childhood. Yes. And then do you immediately jump to Temple to fill that in? Temple I don't see for a few years. From what I remember, one of my best friends in high school and later one of my college roommates, he has a VHS of Temple that I watch. I don't watch until high school.

[00:28:45] I don't think I saw Temple until just it was randomly on TV or whatever. But I do feel like a lot of the most iconic things I knew about Indiana Jones before seeing any of them were images from Temple, which is weird. I think we talk about it in that episode, but there was such a media frenzy around look how fucking Jack Harrison Ford got for Temple that I think the imagery of him with like the ripped off sleeve and the machete

[00:29:08] and his chest showing was for a long time kind of just one of the most repeated Indiana Jones images. And him, him tied up to a stake. I remember feeling like that was really scary in my head. And again, I haven't rewatched all of them for recent purposes. And I know I will also say, too, I'm not obsessive with Indiana Jones. Him, the big ball chasing him. That's Temple as well. That's Raiders. That's the iconic image then. They were jumbled up in my mind. But yes, it's it's last crusade in the theater.

[00:29:37] It's Raiders at a summer camp. You're making me realize all three Indies have a big he's tied to something scene. Like the first one has him and Marianne while the arc is being open. The second one has him tied up while they're like hypnotizing him. It's when he's tied to his own dad. Yes. And that yeah. And they talking about fucking. They are talking about talking about fucking tied to your dad, the bondage. They're talking about fucking a I mean, we have to talk about this later. It's a huge part of this movie.

[00:30:04] A movie that is largely airy fun with this sort of sort of silly weird thing at the center of it of like they become Eskimo brothers. They both had sex with the same woman who again, like back to back. Also though, like the psychology of Steven Spielberg making the Nazi that they both had sex with undeniably super hot in her Nazi outfit is I am now old enough to realize the psychological layers of that are very.

[00:30:33] I want to see if there's anything. And I'm sure we should discuss it because I do wonder she's when she's dressed as a Nazi. Yeah. I mean, I agree. Empire of the Sun is the episode right before this. Correct. Yeah. Just as we've been recording a little out order. Correct. Okay. So Bilga, our friend Bilga Beery on that episode put forward the notion that the big shift in Spielberg's career is like at about the midway point.

[00:31:00] He shifts in perspective of making movies from the vantage point of a son, making movies from the vantage point of a father. And that this is kind of the fulcrum movie because it's dealing with both sides of that. Sure. Sure. Which is very interesting to me. And I think through that prism, this movie's relationship to sexuality is very interesting and how weird like Spielberg's relationship to depicting any form of sex in movies or even

[00:31:25] really talking about it is, but also so much of his core trauma being related to the like cuckolding of his dad and being too aware of the sexual lives of his parents and all this sort of shit. It is just funny that this movie is like an Eskimo brothers family adventure comedy that just kind of like won't move on from that. But that also it's like you've set up these Indiana Jones movies that have this sort of like James Bond style. We're going to have a new love interest every movie.

[00:31:53] And then this one basically does the fake out of just like she's not a love interest. She's a villain. And for the second half of the movie, it's going to be him and his dad kind of having a weird conversation about the fact that they both fucked her in the past. I also have been rewatching. I just finished it really deeply meaningful to me. Rewatched the original Star Wars trilogy with my five year old, which anybody who's heard me on the show can imagine that that was like very, very real for me. But I am. Was he like D plus? No, he.

[00:32:23] He loved them. Of course. Who are his guys? Here's the thing that's really, really cool to see. I'm not going to talk about Star Wars. I mean, he did love this movie has so little to do with Star Wars. We can't focus on it too much. Loved Obi-Wan. Loved Obi-Wan, loved every time Obi-Wan came back. It is sad to see though that kids now grow up with enough spoilers that like another kid had told him about Luke and Vader. Yeah. He knew so much about Yoda that you realize the magic of this little impish creature.

[00:32:53] Right, turning out to be a wise old sort of... They all, like he had... I wish I could have seen that cold. I mean... I saw that cold. I saw it cold and it blew my mind. I think I already knew like Yoda's wise. Alright, we're not talking about Star Wars. We're not talking about Star Wars. The only reason I wanted to bring it up because I don't want to dive down the Star Wars rabbit hole is that both Han Solo and Indiana Jones are also by modern standards. And who cares? But I'm like, oh, Harrison Ford played a real good sex pest. I don't think Indiana Jones so much. Okay, so here's... I don't know man. Here's my take.

[00:33:22] Here's a flower. He's a little... He's Pepe Le Pew level in the Venice scene. I agree with you. He gets on the boat with the... Like basically starts rubbing his dick over his pants. I gotta fuck this rod. Like instantaneously. Can we just get that sound clean one more time? I'm like... I agree with you and it speaks to how good Spielberg's story math brain is at this point where he's like, if we later find out she's a Nazi, the audience won't hold it against him.

[00:33:52] He's so smoking hot. But I also think... Like to the point where he's still trying to save her as she tries to steal the Holy Grail one last time. He's like, no, no, no, come on. You gotta get back up here. Like you're like, oh man, she's... That scene is interesting. We'll talk about that. There's dynamics to that scene. I find Willie Scott so annoying. She's one of my least favorite characters in the history of movies. And part of what I find annoying about her is, as we've covered in that episode,

[00:34:18] it feels like a character who's trying to stop Indiana Jones from being an Indiana Jones movie. And the tension between the two of them is just him being like, I'm Indiana Jones. Sooner or later, she's gonna fuck me. I'm just kind of sitting here being like, okay, lady, until she finally breaks down. Right? What I think they correctly identified in sort of recalibrating for this movie is like, man, you know what's Harrison Ford magic and the thing they stumbled upon that you wouldn't think

[00:34:46] would be his superpower is like the back and forth between him and Leia and this guy who's so fucking cool and confident being a little flummoxed by like, fuck, I wish I didn't care about you. Yeah. And you can actually needle me. There's character growth with. I was gonna say too.

[00:35:16] Let's cancel Harrison Ford's early characters. Just like, oh, society has changed. This does. This does feel jarring. Like my kid will watch Indiana Jones someday and be like, it's kind of aggressive with girls that like like it. Yeah, you go. Oh, I'm not saying. Like I don't, I don't care and I'm not looking for a debate on it, but I'm just like, oh, whoa. Like the shift stand out that like this was the most charming motherfucker of our childhood twice.

[00:35:46] I do franchise him charming the shit out of all of us. And it does. You do flag it pretty quickly in 2025. I just think there's an interesting kind of rug pull on this movie, like sort of emasculating him halfway through because the second his dad enters, it's like he's infantilized. And also his dad's like instantaneously calls him sir. Right. And also his dad's like, yeah, I fucked her, you know, and it's just sort of like it kind

[00:36:11] of defangs that weird sexual element of him in a way where it's like now he's like a little boy. Also, it comes. The reveal comes via she talks in her sleep, which I think famously was an improvised line. It's a very good line. Either improvised or maybe suggested by someone, but let's open the dossier. David. Boing. You hear that? Boing. It's a boinging noise. No, that's a spring because spring has sprung. True.

[00:36:40] Spring movie preview, David. What do we got? We got some great upcoming films coming to Regal theaters that we want to direct our listeners towards. Minecraft. Sign up for Regal Unlimited and go see the Minecraft movie. Excuse me. A Minecraft movie. Ah, just the one. I think an interesting titling structure on that one. Do you know that film was directed by? Jared Hess. Isn't that bizarre? Sure. You're more struck by this than I am. I think we should all be talking about this. I think this should be front page news.

[00:37:08] Yeah, but you've also got Drop getting great reactions out of South by Southwest fun horror movies. Chris Carlandin. Yes. You've got Alex Garland's Warfare. Okay. Have you seen that? Well, I'm not sure I can talk about that. Well, interesting. You've got the new Joan Colette Sarah movie. The Woman in the Yard is coming in late March. I'm very, very excited for that. Written by Sam Stefanik. Yes.

[00:37:33] The Amateur, a high concept Rami Malek thriller that seems to have the premise, what if Griffin Newman in action movie? You know, and that's directed by the guy who did One Life. It's really interesting. Really? Yeah. Interesting. We got Sinners coming. Ah, I'm so pumped for Sinners. Coogler and Jordan are back. Yes. That's actually really gonna rock. And of course, friend of the show, Bo and Yang in the wedding banquet. A remake of a film we've covered on this show, written, co-written and starring a past and future guest. The accountant too.

[00:38:03] This is spring. You're boiling everywhere. Spring is for real. Spring is for real. So, well, why are we talking about it? Because of Regal. Well, because this is a perfect opportunity to sign up for Regal Unlimited. What's awesome about all this is that there's lots of interesting different kinds of movies in theaters that you can go see. This is what I like. And with Regal Unlimited, the whole point is you sign up and seeing three, four, five, six of those movies is easy and affordable. Sign up now in the Regal app. Yes.

[00:38:32] Or at the link in the description in our show notes. And use code BLANKCHECK to get 20% off your three-month subscription. And then you're gonna be in the Crown Club. You're gonna get rewards. You're gonna build up points. You can get free popcorns and sodas and upgrades. 25% off candy on Tuesdays. 50% off popcorn. Discounted ticket. Go to the Regal Crown Club website. And as I said, it's a little deep. It's a little buried in here. There is a section where you can redeem your points for old promotional movie memorabilia

[00:39:01] like Red One Socks. Right. Follow the link in the show notes. Go to the Regal app. Click on the Unlimited banner. And then follow the instructions to sign up and enter promo code BLANKCHECK when prompted to receive your discount. And look, I'm just gonna say it again, David. Mmm. Signing up for Regal Unlimited or maybe gifting a membership to a moviegoer in your life. Sure. Great way to support the show. This is a dream advertiser. Yes. A dream partner for us. We wanna keep this going. We think it could benefit everybody. Especially the movies.

[00:39:38] Before Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade, Steven Spielberg was supposed to make Rain Man. That was a masterful moment of leadership. Thank you. Of you leading us out of our manic. Well, please, I'm gonna keep leading up. And just, just... You're really good at this. To tell you, Geth, things we've covered in the previous Indiana Jones movies. Spielberg really wanted to make James Bond. They kept rejecting him. Lucas comes to him and is like, I got a good idea. This is like the James Bond killer. But when he brings it to him, he's like, if you make it, you have to promise me you make three.

[00:40:07] There's sort of this handshake deal of like, I want this to be a franchise. And I don't want you to run off and have shittier Jaws sequels in your wake. I need three out of you. So he's not contractually like tied on paper. But he owes a third Indiana Jones movie. Like a pinky swear. Totally. But I don't want to talk too much about George Lucas. He doesn't have much to do with the Indiana Jones. They're working on scripts for years, right? And it's just sort of not happening. And Spielberg has this attitude of like, I'm not going to do the third one unless I like the script. Because we kind of got eaten alive on template.

[00:40:37] Rain Man. The Martin Bress project. Martin Bress drops out. Steven Spielberg works on that project for a long time. Of course, he eventually drops out for reasons that Griffin is kind of setting up. And Barry Levinson takes over and wins Best Picture and Best Director. And Best Director. Before Spielberg was. Which are trophies that Spielberg obviously was hunting for in the 1980s. Desperately. Also interesting to think about him potentially working with Tom Cruise 15 years earlier than he actually does. He was working with Dustin and Tom Cruise on it.

[00:41:07] Like it's a whole thing. And he says they just could not get the script where he wanted it. And they hit this point where they were planning on an Indy, you know, Indy 3 Memorial Day 1989. And he was like, I'm just going to have to stop doing Rain Man because like, I won't have enough time to do Indy essentially. So, you know, he's made a lot of grown up movies, right? Like before Last Crusade.

[00:41:33] He's made, he's back to back made Color Purple and Empire of the Sun. These two sort of like conscious departures from like the Spielberg type of movie. And Temple of Doom is also like a Spielberg movie that's kind of fighting itself. I think the public is like, can you go back to doing something that's just fun? Can you go have fun? Be a showman again. The other movie, of course, that Spielberg almost does is Big, which was written by his sister Anne.

[00:42:00] And he wanted Harrison Ford to play the part, you know, to play Joey, Joel, right? Yeah. Imagine Harrison Ford dancing on that big piano boy. I'm a little Josh, Josh. Harrison Ford at F.A.O. Schwarzschild. I just don't see that at all. I want to design toys. Um, just pointing his finger at people. And... I like candy. He decides that he would be stealing his sister's thunder in a way. That's the way he sort of puts it.

[00:42:29] And he, I don't know, he steps aside. Which I think was smart and like the path works out better for everyone involved. Harrison Ford has had kind of a great run post Temple of Doom. He does Witness, gets an Oscar nomination. I still think it's one of his best movies. Turns out Witness, very good. Every screenwriting book talks about Witness. It's Witness. Incredible. And he does another movie. Chinatown and Witness. Another movie with Peter Weir, Mosquito Coast, that I feel like at the time is mixed reception, but is a good movie.

[00:42:56] He talks about that as being a real turning point in his career of like, this is not what the public wants out of Harrison Ford. I can't fight it. They're like, they're bought into the brand and they don't care about me going and doing something I find interesting. They want to see me play the hits. Um, then... But is it an excellent film with an excellent performance? And then in 8080, it is frantic. That's not a huge hit. Although it's not a bad movie, the Polanski movie. Uh, and Working Girl, which is a great hit for him.

[00:43:22] And I think a nice swerve in terms of the kind of thing he can do. It's a great creation movie of just like, this guy's movie star, like power is expanding. While Spielberg and Ford are off doing all this stuff, George Lucas, who we're not going to talk about much, apparently. That would have that much to do with this movie. Is developing whatever this will be. Um, uh, tentatively, initially, the Monkey King was the name of this entry. For sure. Which is like ancient Chinese mythology, a very big figure. Yeah.

[00:43:50] He says at first he had said to Steven Spielberg, like, what about the Holy Grail? And Steven Spielberg had been like, meh. Uh, and then he, uh, you know, he goes over to the Monkey King, um, wait a second. Oh, I see. Spielberg says when he was said Holy Grail, he was like, are we going to have like rabbits jumping out of, you know, like he was like Monty Python. Oh, in his mind, the like, the shadow of Monty Python was too big to take Holy Grail seriously. I guess so. Yeah, I like that. So, right.

[00:44:18] So this Monkey King idea, which Chris Columbus, a writer of Gremlins at that point, you know, sort of a- Is a big Amblin, yeah, in house. Developed something eventually is called Indiana Jones in the Lost City of Sun Wu King. Okay. Not rolling off the tongue for me. Not that catchy. Uh, but has this prelude set in a haunted castle, which was something they thought about for Indy too, of like, what if we did like a big haunted Scottish castle with Indy? Uh, and then mostly it's like, uh, set in the Far East or whatever.

[00:44:48] This all gets junked. You know, they eventually just like forget it. Uh, there is, I think a script you can read out there though. Like there's something out there that people have found. And that's when George Lucas is like, please, Holy Grail, can we do my idea for the Holy Grail? There also have always been the rumors that Diane Thomas at some point was developing a version that was the haunted castle expanded at large. The haunted castle thing was just around for a long time. They're like throwing a lot of shit at the wall. But Spielberg was like, I just did Poltergeist.

[00:45:17] I don't want to do another haunted house movie, even if it's a castle. Lucas is Holy Grail, Holy Grail. Spielberg is like, can we put his dad in it? Spielberg basically takes total credit for like, I was the one who's like, that's, Holy Grail is not that interesting to me. The dad thing is interesting. Weird. I wonder why Steven Spielberg was insistent on putting a complicated dad relationship into a movie. Uh, so he's like, we can do a character study here. Like there can be some juice there. And George Lucas said, how is that conducive to the grail search? Sounds like George was a real fun guy.

[00:45:44] George Lucas famously does not like, uh, using interiority to interrogate his own relationship to his father. It's just like, no, Darth Vader is just based on scary people. Like, well, the dad could be like the grail hunter in a way. Right? Like that could be the thing. And Ford likes that idea. They bring in Menno Mayhez, who wrote Color Purple. Uh-huh. Of course. A Dutch white man who wrote the Color Purple. They don't like that script. So they bring in Jeff Boehm, who is the credited guy who had done the Lethal Weapon movies. Big thing I read, uh, Boehm said.

[00:46:14] Yes. Well, also that in the Menno script, to a certain extent, Jones Senior was the MacGuffin. You had this thing of like, he's been kidnapped, he's gone missing looking for it. You don't get to him until the very end of the movie. And Jeff Boehm's like, that's the halfway point. Right. Yeah, let's get him faster. You want at least half a movie of them riffing off each other. I was actually shocked re-watching it to come in today. It's, it's deeper into the existing movie than that. It's 48 minutes in. Yes.

[00:46:43] Where I was like, oh, you already have a really good, fun 48 minutes. Like, imagine. Before Sean Connery even appears. Yes. And imagine if he didn't enter until they like, got to the cave at the end. You know, and you just, I feel like we talk about so many modern movies that do this. Right. Especially like, legacy sequels and shit. Where they're like, and then at the end, you bring out the old guy or whatever. And you're just like, no, we want to see it.

[00:47:07] Like, it feels like sometimes movies outthink the big blow up, like pop at the end of the movie. And like, they think that's the maximum impact and stringing the audience along in anticipation until that point. You're like, no, we want to see the characters. We like doing stuff. If you have a good hook, let it play out rather than let it be a twist. So, you know, I think they settled well, right, on what you're talking about.

[00:47:33] They, initially, Lucas is imagining kind of an Olivier type, like an eccentric British guy. Oh, sure. I guess. More prim and proper, perhaps. But Spielberg is immediately like, no, James Bond. Yes. Like, we need Sean Connery. Which is just like a billion dollar idea. Now, Sean Connery is only 12 years older than Harrison Ford, but they, I think they sell that just great. Ford looks weirdly young, like, I guess, for his age. And Connery looked old. The fact that he let himself go bald and wasn't dyeing his hair and all that shit. You know, he's got the gray.

[00:48:03] I feel like... Lucas is a flat no. He's like, no, he's James Bond. It's overwhelming. It's too much. And Spielberg is correctly like... But he looks so unlike James Bond at this point. And, like, Untouchables has recontextualized him in a really good way. And I also think the 12-year age difference, I feel, was like a movie fun fact that was... I heard a lot as a child of, like, you want to hear something crazy in, like, books I read about movies or, like, in theater pre-movie trivia.

[00:48:30] And much like the box office record getting, like, beaten multiple times, I feel like there are now so many movies where you're, like, the mom is five years older. Where the 12 years between Connery and Ford doesn't feel that insane anymore. I'm also, like... I kind of buy that Connery could have gotten someone pregnant when he was 12. Not to be gross about it. I don't think the movie is asking us to accept that. Thumbs down to that. That's your backstory. I love that that's your backstory.

[00:49:00] Going off of that, though. So... Sean... Sean... Everyone be quiet. This is like one of these kids whose teachers... I'm gonna say something. I think this guy is having a really close relation with his history teacher. Dan Berger. Perhaps some extracurricular studies. I'm picturing a 12-year-old full beard... Full through puberty voice. Listen. The thing I have to say is relevant. Yes, David. That's staying in, by the way. Major Cut can stand down. They bring Connery the script. He has some notes. He's Sean Connery.

[00:49:29] He comes over to George, according to Spielberg, and says, look, anything Indy does in the context of the story, I have done better. When he talks about sleeping with Elsa, write in that I slept with her, too. That's Connery putting that in. Now, in that context, it sounds like Connery's idea was... The story's idea was back-to-back. I do think it was a gift for the movie. I do think they figured out the right way to execute that. He... He... Connery is so charming and funny in this movie.

[00:49:55] Is it fair to say he is to the Indiana Jones franchise what Samuel Jackson is to the Die Hard franchise? This injection of joy and fun in the third one. Yes, I mean, for certain... I know what you're saying, right. The third movie getting like a kind of lift. The second one is wobbly, and this killer performance brings it back in the middle. Comedically. We covered those last year. I've listened. Right, and it was a similar thing where we're just like, Die Hard 2 doesn't have a handle on what this is anymore, and is just trying to repeat the same thing and find ways to flip it.

[00:50:22] You're right where they're just like, we need to like balance this with something else. We need someone... I agree with you. I think that's a really good take. Thank you so much. And also solves their problem of like, how do you top Marion? Connery's take is... Which is like, don't make it a new love interest. He thinks Indy is kind of a dork. I'm so nervous about the tension between Griffin's interjections and David's... David's trying to... No, I'm just trying to get... I got you. I got you. I'm on your team. I'm a good boy.

[00:50:48] I'm truly just trying to read this great statement from Sean Connery who's definitely not problematic in any way. Okay. I didn't want the father to be so much of a wimp. Aside from the fact that Indiana Jones is not as well dressed as James Bond. I mean, they're not really in the same dress area. Yes. But okay. The main difference between them is sexual. Indiana deals with women shyly. In the first film, he's flustered when the student writes I love you on her eyelids. James Bond would have had all those young coeds for breakfast. Just... He used to just, you know...

[00:51:18] Say shit. Yeah. I do feel like they kind of trick Connery into playing more of a wimp than he realizes. By doing this bit of he's kind of like the whole movie being like, all these theatrics, it's unbecoming to do this fucking adventure hero shit. Like the intellectual aspect of it. Even if he's like, fucked Elsa first. It does have this vibe of just like, he is a man of letters. He is smarter and more mature. But that... And he's unimpressed with everything Indy's doing.

[00:51:46] It gives him alpha energy of like... It does. I don't know how to use these guns and planes and shit. And when they're in the car, he's just like, go faster! You know where it's like... It is a perfect balance of the two things. I think it's really good. They found a way to satisfy his, I need to be the coolest guy note, in a way that is funny and gives Indiana Jones more to fight against in terms of feeling low status. But I also think some of that is to give credit to the filmmakers and the choices surrounding it.

[00:52:15] Like, is not some of that intentional in the themes of like, nobody thinks their dad is cool when you're young. Yes. And then you grow up and realize maybe your dad has done some cool stuff. And then obviously, the other side of the coin, which I think the idea of this being the fulcrum between son to father in Spielberg, you go, in a movie that is weirdly almost all set pieces and almost all big adventure fun, that line Sean Connery has of like, I never even told him anything.

[00:52:44] It would have taken five minutes. Weirdly emotional to watch as a dad right now who has thought a lot about my relationship with my father and my relationship with my son. You did a great one person show that is available for public consumption? It was an unaudible. It was an unaudible. That is all about that? About you sort of reexamining your relationship with your father through the prism of being a dad? That line always, I mean, I will also say, and I don't want to jump too far ahead, like,

[00:53:11] I do have such a distinct, you know, when you learn how movies work, some of the magic goes away. I remember being nine years old and when the tank went off the cliff, I was, I was like, oh shit. Oh, you bought it. Indiana Jones is dead. Okay. Okay. You were young enough. I hadn't been trained that that was never going to happen. Yeah. Um, so that move, that moment really stands out to me, but rewatching it today as a dad of like, I never, it would have taken five minutes.

[00:53:38] But here's the other thing I think this movie is very clever about is like the real narrative spine of this thing, or let's say the emotional spine of this is that like Indiana Jones would tell you I'm nothing like my father. Right. I hate my father and the hate, but he, right. My dad. I didn't really know. I didn't know each other. He was not good at, he was not there for me. You know, the brilliance of the opening sequence, which kind of does this mislead of like Indiana

[00:54:08] Jones had one encounter with this random stranger who seems so fucking cool and mythical that he modeled his whole life after him. And yet this movie is like Indiana Jones doesn't realize that he's become his father. That's so much of what he does is informed by his father. He's like, I'm different. He accuses his dad of like you bailed and dodged all responsibility when the only reason he's here is because we watched him climb out of a window to not do his job at the university. And not to jump all the way to the end, but it's like the thing of Connery on the floor

[00:54:37] talking through the things he hopes Indiana Jones has digested about the grail. Yeah. So that he can make it through the traps and Indy's running in his head and it being this sort of silent disconnected dialogue between the two of them. Although I would argue Griffin and we can pin this for later. I would actually argue that the narrative spine of this movie strangely is an ode to the wonders of transportation. Okay. Well, I'm interested in that. You're lighting David up right now.

[00:55:07] I want to just say the other, the prologue, the young Indiana Jones prologue is another George Lucas idea that Spielberg is also very resistant to kind of against people being like, I've kind of done that. Right. Like I've done so much, you know, movies about kids and stuff like that. Also, do we need to like explain Indiana Jones? Which I'm like, this is the good version of what I hate every time a modern franchise movie tries to do it.

[00:55:32] But this movie somehow just like gives you 10 minutes with a lot of like, that's the first time with the whip. That's the first time with the hat. Here's how we got the scar. I love it so much. And part of it's that it's like they don't hit it with dialogue, that it's all visual and that it moves so fast. And that part of it is like dismantling him as like, this is like a show. This is like a posture, you know? Are there any other films you guys can think of that do the little mini movie before the movie?

[00:56:01] Like Inglourious Bastards? Yeah, there's I feel like there's I mean, my recent fave The Empty Man. Yeah. You know, I like movies that do that that are kind of like, right, like we're going to tell a whole contained little mood setting story. Some of the lore, some of the mythology. I feel like that's I mean, that is a James Bond thing usually. So like we're going to have a whole little James Bond mission happen and then credits and then James Bond will begin the main mission, which may or may not be connected that much. There's maybe more of it in horror, like the opening of screens version of that.

[00:56:30] You know, the misdirect of like this is your fake lead. There's definitely lots of examples. I do always love that. This one is beloved, right? In general, I would imagine. This movie is beloved as. I would be shocked if there's any people that are like the River Phoenix thing felt like extraneous. Part of it is that River Phoenix is so good. He's really good. He had worked with him on Mosquiticus where he was his son. Harrison Ford, yes. And like they pitched this to Ford and he's like, A, I think River Phoenix is a great actor. B, that's the working actor in his age group who looks the most like I looked at my at that age.

[00:57:00] Have you guys looked up? I looked up the chubby wet friend. The chubby wet friend is really good. Oh, it's me. Yeah, yeah, yeah. The story of that actor is pretty fascinating. Really? Pretty fascinating. Who's the actor? Do you remember the name? I am remiss because I took a bunch of notes on my laptop, which I did not bring. But that actor, look if you get. Is it fascinating in a way where if we start talking about it on mic, it would bum us out?

[00:57:30] No, I don't think so. Okay. I think he, if I remember right now, he's like a fitness guru with a lot of opinions on having Ben in the Indiana Jones mini movie. Was he credited as chubby wet? No, I forget his character's name, but he's just, I just, he's a chubby friend and he's strangely wet. He's sweaty to the degree of wetness through the entirety of the River Phoenix mini movie.

[00:57:53] There is a desert. He's credited on all these like big Amblin movies or sequels or whatever. And you're like, oh, this guy must have been like a Shane Black, Joe Esterhouse, like died in a mountain of cocaine, was like doing high paid script punch up. Isn't that the answer? No. Okay. He had like a bizarre like heart illness.

[00:58:22] He died young after a protracted battle. And then you read about him for being this guy who they like brought into fixed scripts and got paid so much and has all these huge credits. He sounds a lot closer to John Hughes where it was like, didn't like the industry, was a real family man, just had really good story math instincts. And all these things where they bring him a script that was like, this has been development for 10 years. The premise is great, but yet no one can crack it. We keep attaching talent, but we lose them.

[00:58:50] And he would just be like, here's the problem right here. And just immediately solve it. Like the emotions of it. And you can read his Wikipedia is really thorough and actually very well written. And it goes through like project by project and what his takes on each project. Very few he originated. And it was like one of his things where he was like, Henry Jones, senior has to come through at the halfway point, like stuff like that, where he would just immediately go, that's the movie. And it's just kind of a tragic loss.

[00:59:18] Um, the thing about his screenplay just to note is that according to Spielberg, Tom Stafford wrote every single line of dialogue in this film. That I believe that. Which was sort of like at that point, Stafford had written Empire of the Sun for him. Like, Stafford is right. So like all those great lines we were talking about, I think a lot of that is coming from Tom Stafford. Anyway, Spielberg, I think, recognizes after Temple of Doom. Oh, Daniel Miller Elliott should be in this movie. John Rhys-Davis should be in this movie.

[00:59:46] Like, I don't know why I didn't have his friends from the Raiders of the Lost Ark that everyone liked not being the second movie. You talking about being surprised at how late Connery comes in. I was surprised where I was like, in my memory, the whole second half of the movie is like the four of them as a wrecking crew. Yeah. To me, it was much closer to the River Phoenix prologue. And then we're pretty quickly into this father stories. Oh no, that's all after Venice and the church and all this stuff. And because it ends with like, oh, the four of them riding off into the sunset, iconically,

[01:00:16] I'm like, all four of them are together for the whole second half. Right. And it's like, no, Denim and like, John Rhys-Davis are kind of off at their own thing. They only really all converge at the very end. But it is so nice to have both of them in there. And Spielberg's just so clearly aware of like, these guys fucking rule. The audience loves these characters. Let's give them more fun. And which I think is a wise decision. Allison Doody, who plays Elsa. Which let's say is funny to say, funny to hear. An Irish actress. Not to be disrespectful. Her name is Allison Doody.

[01:00:45] Her name is Allison Doody. There's no, you know, getting around. I can't, as someone whose last name spells Gathard, I cannot participate in a last name. I'm not being mean. She made her debut as a sort of like, small character in A View to a Kill, the Bond movie. Yes. Which when we did that Patreon series, I was like, who the fuck is that? Started doing like wolf whistles and then I was like, oh, it's Allison Doody. And so I guess she's kind of getting cast off of that.

[01:01:15] It's sort of interesting. She is kind of plucked out of relative obscurity and doesn't really have a big career. With Spielberg at the time. He was like, I want a Grace Kelly. I found this woman. She looks like Grace Kelly. She does have the look like Gath was saying. Like to a T, you know, she. But also this character is going to be a mystery. Weird fantasy creature. You know, it's like, right. It is, again, we'll get there. But she is obviously an extraordinarily attractive human being and is playing an object of affection for multiple characters in this movie.

[01:01:46] But a costumer made a choice to say she shall be at her most smoking hot while in full Nazi regalia. River Phoenix, obviously brought to Spielberg by Harrison Ford. Julian Glover, obviously had been in the Empire Strikes Back. Right? We had him do. I think he'd interviewed for other like parts in Indiana Jones movies before. Like he was very on their radar. Possibly.

[01:02:15] We had him on George Lucas talk show. A thing that I've told you and you went like, that's kind of depressing for him. Correct. And the weirdest thing. He plays Colonel Veers, right? Yes. Yes. Yes. He's the guy in the AT-AT who's like. Yes. Your favorite character. No, my favorite. No. No. Pied's your favorite. I'm sorry. They are companion characters. Yeah, but Admiral Pied.

[01:02:40] Your favorite thing in Star Wars is that sidebar of Empire of the sort of weird. Empire 2 Jedi. He's in both. Yes. The fact that he's just the guy who someone gets killed next to him and then it's like, you're in charge. And he's like, fuck. David wrote a very good piece of The Atlantic about that. Yeah, the Ballad of Admiral Pied. Yeah, one of my best pieces. And then like, he makes it all the way to the end of Jedi. Like he keeps dodging Vader strangling him, even though he fucked up himself. He's in the corporate machine. Yes. Climbing the corporate ladder, trying to stay out of the way, which is a very relatable

[01:03:10] thing for anyone who has ever worked in. He's the only Star Wars Empire character, I mean, member of the Empire that they bother to give any arc. Everyone else tends to just kind of die. David, I guess I just don't understand your obsession with bringing up Star Wars every time. Fucking love Admiral Piet so much. Speaking of favorite Star Wars characters though, this movie has a Kit Fisto, everybody. Who is? Kazim. Kazim is your Fisto. Kazim is the Fisto of this movie. He's pretty cool.

[01:03:39] I thought you were gonna say that Grail Knight is your Fisto. Oh, there's so much. The Grail Knight is cool. The Grail Knight's maybe the saddest character in the history of the cinema. We need to save this. The Grail Knight is very melancholy. We need to save this, but when I threw the list to Geth and was like, we're doing Spielberg, what do you want? You responded with a Grail Knight specific. There's so much to say. A statement that might sound hyperbolic, but that I kind of agree with you. What did I say? I'll remind you, but it was your whole reason for wanting to do this movie. You didn't tell me the stuff with your dad. Yeah.

[01:04:09] Just being such a pivotal experience. You focus on the Grail Knight and you had it taken. I said, you have to do that episode. It's... I have so much to say about the Grail Knight, but what... Maybe Kazim is like the saucy tin. Kazim is the guy. Yeah, he's the Kid Fisto though, where he shows up, doesn't get much screen time. You're kind of like, I want to see... Like this guy has some... Where I'm like, I would watch... Whatever this fucking Brotherhood of the Cruciform Sword bullshit is, give me a Disney Plus preview. But they also came bringing... Give me an Andor for the Cruciform Sword crew. I think I can say this. Who's Kazim?

[01:04:38] He has fucked shit up in his life. He will do so again. And now he's gone. I love... That's Kid Fisto. Years ago, auditioned for what they had said was untitled Star Wars project. And when I read the sides, I was like, this is clearly a young Indiana Jones show. Uh-huh. Uh-huh. And it was going to be animated. And then I think as like Dial of Destiny was kind of getting complicated, they were like, let's just focus on this and not do the sideshow.

[01:05:06] But there was going to be a Disney Plus animated sort of like River Phoenix-esque rather than young Indiana Jones-esque. And after X-Men 97, I think they could pull it off. X-Men 97, some of the best television writing last year. There's something like X-Men 97 where it's like, people are not only nostalgic for the sort of old throwback X-Men. They're nostalgic for the 90s cartoon aesthetics, the 90s cartoon plotting.

[01:05:33] Like, it's like, it's not just that X-Men 97 is like, oh, let's sort of like do a new X-Men. It's like, no, no, we're picking up the thread of that show. We're weirdly bold to go, it's not a new show. Yeah, it's like sort of just season six. We're bringing it back. And also, we're just like picking good comic storylines that weren't adapted. Also, everyone who likes this has aged by 25 to 30 years. So like, we'll do some stuff you can handle 25 to 30 years. Yeah, it'll be more mature. It was a wild swing. It was good.

[01:06:02] The thing that was very funny about the Indiana Jones cartoon thing was usually, you know, you'll get these breakdowns and it'll be like, untitled Lucasfilm project. And you read it and you're like, this is Star Wars, but they're trying to hide that it's Star Wars. Yes. Space Bears, famously. Right. This they sent out as untitled Star Wars cartoon show. And I was like, oh, cool. I'm auditioning for a Star Wars cartoon show. And then I read the sides and they gave all the characters alien names. But they talked about being at a university and studying adventurers and wanting to collect relics.

[01:06:32] And I was like, you're using Star Wars as a cover for it being Indiana Jones. And you've named all the characters like Blork Blork. But I was like, I think I'm reading for either young Sala or young Brody. It was one or the other. Your young, your Watto experience could make you a fantastic animated Sala. I think so. But this show has just not happened. David. What? This episode is brought to you by Mubi. Hello, Mubi.

[01:07:02] Once again, here we are in March 2025. And we are so happy that Mubi continues to sponsor the show. They are a curated streaming service dedicated to elevating great cinema from around the globe, from iconic directors to emerging auteurs. There's always something new to discover with Mubi. Each and every film is hand selected so you can explore the best of cinema streaming anytime, anywhere. And that's fine. You can go to Mubi. You can watch great movies streaming. It's really great. It's not fine. It's great. Fantastic. But they've also got Mubi.

[01:07:32] Mubi. Which are theaters and then stream exclusively on Mubi. Such as? Academy Award winner, The Substance. Might have heard of it. It's quite a big breakthrough. Harley Farge's movie from 2024. It was nominated for best picture, best director, best actress. Yes. One for best makeup. Yes. If you, somehow, have not seen The Substance yet, the place you gotta go is Mubi. Yep. Yeah. It's streaming exclusively there.

[01:08:01] I think it's actually back in theaters for a short time because of the Oscars. Cool. But you've got Demi, you've got Dennis Quaid, you've got Margaret Cawley, you've got this Gonzo script. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. You've got this crazy lurid imagery, this, you know, insane satire. It's a wild movie. And proved. It's a must see. I would say. Griff's mom approved. Oh, fascinating. I took her to see it. I thought she was going to walk out and she gave it two grossed out thumbs up. So you can check all that out.

[01:08:27] And of course, to stream great films at home, you can try Mubi free for 30 days. That's M-U-B-I dot com slash blank check for a month of Grey Cinema for free. Mubi. David. Yes. Do you mind if I try out some new impressions on you? I've been working on some impressions for my Mad TV audition. I think they're going to bring it back again. Okay, ready?

[01:08:57] Here's my first impression. What's that? That's me shopping for glasses in the past. No. Used to be so bad. Unhappy, stressed, miserable, angry. But? Here's a new impression. And why do you feel that way now? And describe my face. What am I doing? You're happy, smiling. I'm grinning because I'm shopping at Warby Parker.

[01:09:26] When and what happened? Warby Parker changed all that. See, this is the impression. Grumpy guy. And Warby Parker changed all that into this. Yeah. So Warby Parker, the glasses store. They use nothing but premium materials in every frame. Warby Parker designs every frame in-house. Their collection includes silhouettes, colors, and fits made to suit every face. This is true. I exclusively wear Warby Parker glasses. I made the jump probably 10 years ago.

[01:09:53] Glasses shopping used to be a thing that drove me crazy. And Warby has great options. They refresh constantly. Mm-hmm. But it's also, they are more affordable. They cut out the middleman. They're high quality, but you don't feel the same kind of pressure. I always used to feel picking glasses going, Oh my God, I'm gonna have to stick to these for a decade. They're durable. But it's not just glasses. Yeah. Because I don't wear eyeglasses, but I wear sunglasses. Exactly. And I do have some great, a couple of great pairs of Warby sunglasses.

[01:10:22] And I'm busting out now that the weather's good again. They, look, I will say you go to any of their physical locations, they have incredible employees who are so good at genuinely just looking at your face and going, you know what would work? They understand the sort of, uh, the geometrics of the glasses and the human skull. And you can get wide fit and wide bridge boxier, you know, whatever your type is. They provide eye exams.

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[01:11:17] But here's the thing I like in the past, they've offered both the Griffin and the Newman. Oh, that's fun. Isn't that fun? Uh, and the Durand of course is named after character actor Kevin Durand. You know what, David? Every time I look at the glasses, I think that. That guy's great. He's incredible. Well, I got to tell you, Griff, and I've said it before. Mm-hmm. Glasses really compliment your face. Hey, thank you very much. That's that Warby Parker magic. And if you're not close to a location, you can do the virtual try on at home. They can send you a couple pairs.

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[01:12:18] I'm going to push back on Kazim being the Fisto. And I'm going to say this. I'm going to explain my reason behind this. Not that he's not your Fisto, but in terms of his function in relation to the movie. And it's what I like about Kazim. Okay. Okay. Is that like, you're saying always mysterious. I'd love to watch a whole series about him. He's like, he goes a little deeper than this character does in the other Indiana Jones films, the characters that occupy this kind of role. Right?

[01:12:48] We joked about in the other episodes that like, outside of your main like intellectual rival in the Indiana Jones movies, most of the iconic Indiana Jones films don't have names. It's like German mechanic and monkey man and like thuggy guard. Right? Guy who swings things around until he gets shot. Kyro swordsman. I mean, truly like the merch doesn't even name them, which Lucas loves doing. They all are just the description of who they are and you get nothing more. Right?

[01:13:15] And even if you're spending a whole sequence with the fucking guy and there's a sense of character, you're like, this guy is defined by his, what he wears or what his job is or what he holds. And that is his whole fucking prism. The fact that Kazim like introduces himself and starts to explain himself a little already makes him a little less mysterious.

[01:13:37] And you're just like, oh, I'm not used to like Indiana Jones like side goons being fleshed out to this degree. And I similarly think it's a nice surprise when he pops back up again, where you're like so blatantly facing away from camera until he. But you're like, I was ready to never see Kazim again. But I think I think the Fisto thing is that like, see, we have a, I think a fundamental misunderstanding of what the Fisto is as a film archetype, which I think everyone would agree that is a film archetype. It is.

[01:14:07] Let's unpack. But I just think the idea of like, who's that person? They're visu, they're visually intriguing. They're. Kazim looks great. Looks great. And, and also both Kazim and Fisto, those parts were written small, but I would argue that the actors, the actors squeezed more juice. The actors squeezed more juice out of that than ever was intended by the screenwriter director. It's a fucking juicero machine performance. Yeah.

[01:14:36] These, the Fisto is the juicer of the movie who squeeze more juice than you ever thought. And Kazim squeezed so much more juice and intrigued the audience to a degree where much like Fisto in the prequel trilogies, you can't help but walk away and go. There are parts of the plot I don't remember. And I've been looking forward for decades to learn the plot of this. Yeah. But what I do remember is that that green guy with those tendrils was fucking cool.

[01:15:03] Kit Fisto except for this is his reaction to Palpatine, you know, attacking with a lightsaber. Yeah. I mean, David did. Which is the worst part of the movie. I would argue that I would argue that I would argue that I would have an impression of Kit Fisto. Kazim's death in this, I would say, maybe equally overwhelming compared to his punching above his weight and earning a little bit more in the audience's mind. Odette Fair in The Mummy. Yes. Is kind of a plussed up version of this character. He's Kazim as like co-leader.

[01:15:31] And he's like in the whole movie where it's like, right, they're going to The Mummy's tomb and a guy shows up who's like, my entire life job is making sure nobody fucking goes to The Mummy's tomb. Both, I know how scary it is. And it's this sort of like holy thing for me. You're right, though. It's one of the smart things The Mummy does is it makes Kazim the Sala. Have that character basically join the team. It makes Kazim the Sala. And then he can show up. Sure. I'm gonna say one more time. Okay. It kind of makes Kazim the Sala.

[01:15:57] Can I also put another thing out here that I never thought I'd have an opportunity to say, and this did just occur to me, this was not pre-planned. Yeah. As we establish the archetype of The Fisto, the reason that the movie The Warriors is such a cult classic that has stood the test of time, even with the director's cuts trying to make it worse, is it's a movie comprised almost entirely of Fisto. I think it is fair to say that movie is an oops-all Fisto. Exactly.

[01:16:24] That movie is, even half the main characters are Fistos. Something went wrong at the Cap'n Crunch factory and now the whole movie is made out of Fistos. That entire gathering that happens like- It's a Fisto convention. It's a Fisto convention. Yeah, exactly. Exactly. Oh, this is my dream conversation. Can you dig it, Fistos? So, Grail Knight. So, Grail Knight. No, no, no. We're not getting to Grail Knight yet. We're not getting to Grail Knight yet! The city is yours! If you Fistos can count!

[01:16:54] I will say just- Fistos! Just do- Come out and play! To return to the dossier. This film was shot- You don't wanna go down a combo warriors, kid Fisto rabbit hole in your Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade episode. This film is shot in 63 days, which is fairly impressive given the scale. Spielberg, man. The vibe from the set is literally basically everyone's just like, we had a great time, everyone got along and it went really well.

[01:17:22] Like there is no drama emerging from Last Crusade. Ford and Connery are like, we fucking clicked right away, we both liked what we were doing. Can I put forward an analog? It's obviously at the absolute peak, I think, at this point of like, give this man an action sequence and he will run it like a machine. Can I put forth a movie analog? Yes. Oceans 13 and Last Crusade, I think are similar. Yes, I mean, Last Crusade's better than Oceans 13, I do like Oceans 13 a lot.

[01:17:48] No, I think Last Crusade's a much better version of this, but like, we tried something different with the second one and people were less into it. We're sorry, we're gonna give you the exact Indiana Jones sequel we think you want, you know? And I think there is that like freedom, especially because he's coming off of some grown up movies where he's like, it'd be fun to play with toys again. And like, he makes Schindler's List so shortly after this, things like making the Nazi woman hot. The merchandising line from Schindler's List notoriously bombed.

[01:18:16] I will say, Spielberg insisted on the book. I did get you to giggle. It's the last time he's able to kind of have this sort of fun successfully. Yeah, but that's what I don't like about this movie. Okay. Some of it feels a little right. I don't know. Punching below is... Yeah, it's below. Can I say one other thing too? If in the movie The Warriors, you replaced every time they said the word boppers with the word fistos, everything about that movie not only still works, but gets better. I'll move on. I'll move on.

[01:18:45] David is holding up a noose. I'll move on. I'll move on. Don't care about this. No, my point about Last Crusade. Spielberg insists or has the idea of including a moment that I really think is interesting in Last Crusade, which is when you see when they're in Berlin, like books being burned. Which is this moment of like unlevity, right? Like where you're like, Jesus fucking Christ. Almost every other moment, the Nazis in this movie are cartoon nobodies, right?

[01:19:11] Who are literally just like bowling pins for Indy to knock down and shit. And weirdly old crusty guys too. He makes them like feeble and old and gross. They are really toothless in this movie in a way that's interesting compared to even Raiders, where they're quite sinister and like, you know, good villains. And certainly given that he's beginning to think about things like Schindler's List. This is 89, Schindler's List is 93. I don't have a problem with it. It's not like I'm like, oh, this movie is, you know, offensive, like, you know, with its cartoon Nazis.

[01:19:40] I'm just kind of like, it does feel like Spielberg has run out of things to do with that sort of stuff. Like, it's like, it's a little paint by numbers. That they're so silly. I mean, this movie is silly. This movie has a very good like tone to it that it doesn't deviate from. Even the book burning scene though. I'm like, it has this, it puts a pit in your stomach and it has since I was a kid. It does. And they're marching. It's one of the only moments that really does that.

[01:20:06] But then it goes on so long that you do start to realize like, even with all this, they're just marching in a fucking circle sniffing their own farts. Right. There is like, you don't think there's any part of Spielberg that's like, fuck these Nazis. I think there is. I just, they're toothless and our two main heroes. He's leechers. One of them. I think, you know, like, have we talked about that? I think the Nazis are scarier in Raiders. Way scarier.

[01:20:30] I think, I think weirdly, I agree with you that they're sort of like a more pointed kind of like, uh, uh, these clowns. Yeah. In a way. As much as he makes them goofier in this movie has so much more of a like cartoon tone. He, it does feel like he's attacking them in personality and like culturally a lot more. I even think the like Hitler signing the grail diary thing. An insane moment. Is like a moment of just like, right, this guy's just like a fucking narcissist.

[01:21:00] Right? Like all of this just came out of this guy with like a complex who like literally when handed the thing he's hired goons to find for him still just thinks that some. Right. Right. You want my autograph. There's also I just, I'm like a contextual note. I, this movie I did realize I'm like, oh, these guys who are actors who go to school for it, who train, who work really hard, who get to an, a level where they can be in major motion pictures.

[01:21:28] And then they happen to look enough like Hitler to credibly play Hitler. Well, you never wanted a phone call. You get stuck. You know what I mean? I'm like, damn, man, that's a typecasting. That's real weird. We've, we talked about in other recent episodes, like the world of people who are that for Lincoln. And that's a much better silo to be in. There's Hitler guy. You know, there's a Rolodex of Hitler guys in casting offices. Like you'll book shit, but you got to keep putting on that little fucking mustache.

[01:21:54] But I just want to, I just want to tell you guys something that seems you do not know. Please tell me. Do you know who plays Hitler in this movie? I always forget. It's Michael Sheard is the name of the actor. But do you know another role that he played? He plays Ozzel, Admiral Ozzel. Ah, yes. In the Empire Strikes Back. Again, David, you're really pushing the Star Wars thing hard. Who is the guy who comes out of light speed too fast. Yeah. Yeah, fucks up, gets killed so that Admiral Piette gets to be the next. You think you need to tell me who Admiral Ozzel is?

[01:22:23] I'm just saying, I don't think that guy played Hitler again. I have not always been respectful on this show. I've not always been the most respectful guest. That's one of the most disrespectful things anyone's ever done to me. Chris, let me just remind you that our show is being listened to by people who may not immediately know who fucking Admiral Ozzel is. Speaking of Star Wars admirals, I recently did text Bobby Moynihan, and I'm not someone who smokes weed at all. I just texted Bobby the other day, what if Admiral Ackbar wasn't an actor? What if that was a real guy?

[01:22:52] What if you were like, outline at Trader Joe's and the guy checking out in front of you, and you could be like, big fan. I don't know if I can repeat it, but Bobby Moynihan's Ackbar baby used to do with the UCB. Oh, no, no, no. No, I can't say, but was incredibly good. Can I close two loops on two things here? David. I shudder. Things that have already been set up. What? Julian Sands was on George Lucas' talk show, right? It was... Julian Sands? No. Julian Glover. I'm sorry. When I told you that, you were like, that's depressing for him.

[01:23:22] Yes. That he had to be interviewed by you guys. And I think it was in London, we were doing an all day stream of people who have been in movies with Harrison Ford and using that as the thread. So we talked to him about like both Star Wars and Indiana Jones. Right. He said that Donovan is easily his favorite role he's ever played in his career. He's really, really good. And for a guy who's like classically trained, I expect him to sort of be like, well, those are like fun, silly movies I did for money and they're like serious roles I prefer.

[01:23:48] And he was like, no, it was so great to be the main baddie in an Indiana Jones movie. Although he has fun with the turn. Look, he's really good. I think he's a great villain. He's probably it's weird. He is the main villain. Yes. And at the same time, it's like you have Vogel and you have Allison. And Allison, dude, he's kind of more like the right, the active villain in a way. But he's really good. And the turn is really clever with him.

[01:24:15] I know to this point of what we were saying about this movies like take on the Nazis. I think this character is sort of like a heightening of fucking Belloc. Right. Where it's like this guy has like a lot less swag than Belloc. He's a lot less cool. He's just kind of a dork in a certain way. He's like a rich dork hobbyist. That's the thing. He's he's like all these jerks we have to deal with now where it's like it's very weird where I'm like you don't even have an ideology.

[01:24:43] Probably you became a Nazi because you want the Holy Grail because it's like the best thing forever. And we're living in an era where some of these billionaire assholes are trying to figure out how to live. I will say that. It's sort of just like I don't you know when Indiana Jones is like you're working with Nazis. He's just sort of like I don't think about things that right. Right. Like Donovan is like doesn't really up with moral just I joined the club so that I can get the Holy Grail. Right. And that has this terrifying line of like I'll be living forever long after the Nazi party's dead like it doesn't matter what I did to support them.

[01:25:13] But you also have him like set up in the movie the way the film introduces him. It feels like he is the guy who sends Indiana Jones on the mission not the guy who's going to be his rival the whole time. Right. And you're like he fits into that role of just being the guy who like introduces the MacGuffin. But it's a little too slick. Yeah, it's a little too slick. But I'm like I think there's something fun to this character being like these guys are not cool at all. And people who do this are like morally bankrupt and like uninteresting.

[01:25:44] All right. Just before we move on totally from what I thought I just got to give props. Admiral Azzel and Hitler. That's a hell of an IMD. I was going to say that's what I was saying. You put that on a tombstone. I don't think that's an actor who did a lot of Hitler. He had a broad British whatever career. This was the other thing that's this was the other thing. And that's Hitler in there. That Glover said was just like Spielberg was really loyal. I'm sorry, Lucas was really loyal to those guys. His British character actor guys. And that he was saying like Steven, we're hiring Glover.

[01:26:13] You know, like my guys we've had in London have just been fucking cooking. I love the idea that George Lucas calls that guy up. He's like I got your back. I'm going to get you back in. It's going to be a blockbuster. You can make residuals. And you're playing a really well-known character. Yeah. So you're going to be Adolf Hitler. Clearly, I must have like some meaty monologues. Like it's kind of a non-speech thing. What's the other loop? It's an under five. It's an under five. What's the other loop you wanted to call?

[01:26:42] I'm trying to remember. I'll come back. Don't forget it. I'll remember. It's the opposite. Let's not jump to the end. The whole thing with Last Crusade is like as much as it has lots of fun stuff. I do feel like 80% of what everyone wants to talk about is just the grail scene because it's such a little short story of a scene. Right. And it's so weird. And also, if you minute you start to overthink it, you're like, I'm sorry. Elsa is just like this one. And he's like, yeah, I believe you. Aren't you supposed to be like rich and smart? I remember the other thing.

[01:27:12] It rocks. We'll get to it. I remember the other thing. I agree. That's more relevant in two earlier episodes, but makes sense within the context of what we're talking about here. I forgot to mention these two. 1941. Have you ever seen it yet? I have not blanked that. Spielberg film. Spielberg's first attempt at like making Nazis villains in a kind of like popcorn movie that isn't going to take it seriously. Right. Well, they're barely. It's only Christopher Lee. That film is more about the Japanese. Yeah. Christopher Lee plays a Nazi officer who's working with the Japanese.

[01:27:42] And it just like doesn't work. And Christopher Lee, obviously like one of the greatest. I mean, he's doing his best. And he's introduced speaking German. And you're just like, I can't wait to hate Christopher Lee as a comedy Nazi. And it doesn't connect. Spielberg wrote and shot and cut Christopher Lee in 1941 doing the exact coat hanger bit. He was like, here's a really funny idea. You have a twisted Nazi character. He takes out a device.

[01:28:11] You think he's going to torture the guy. There's this whole interrogation subplot in that movie. And then it turns out just a coat hanger. And this guy cares about his fancy clothes more. And he was like, I thought it was so funny. I put in the movie. It felt fucking flat. It was silence. It was dead. And I couldn't get over it. And I was like, I have to make this joke work in something. And then I was like, Raiders, we built this character. Toad, it would work for him. Right. And it was like, it fucking played like gangbusters. I wasn't going to throw that out.

[01:28:38] That speaks to his like growth in learning how to calibrate. How can you do Nazis in a movie where you're not dealing with the full weight and severity of what they did, but you're also not completely turning them into like silly bullshit. Right. Which 1941, that's a larger problem with that movie. It doesn't have to deal with serious issues in a funny way. Raiders does it in a more scary way. But pulpy.

[01:29:05] This movie, I think, has the right version of like comedy Nazis because it does take more pot shots at their expense. There's also just something. I do think there's something to note about. There's a documentary, I believe, called The Last Laugh, all about how Jewish comedians deal with Holocaust jokes. Mm-hmm.

[01:29:27] And seeing someone of Spielberg's generation come about as a very prominent Jewish director and see him sort out how to portray Nazis throughout the course of his career. There's just something obvious to be said about culturally it's fascinating. And like there's no real way to get it right. I just see him like that does represent on some level. My big feeling for I think Julian Glover is fun. I think Allison Doody is fun. I don't think I'm just my big note for this movie. It's not even a big note. I don't care.

[01:29:56] I like this movie. I think it's fun. I think it's a good movie. It's just I don't there's nothing scary about the villainy in it, really. So there's just a lot of stakes. But the whole second half, it's like no, but the major conflict becomes him figuring out shit with his dad. That conflicts that stuff is fine. That sort of supplants the who's the bad guy. But to me, that is then completely resolved after the tank goes off the cliff. Like after that, they are they are settled. I think part of it, David, that I do. And then we just do the grail, which is fun.

[01:30:24] But at that point, they the Nazis, I'm not like scared of them at all. Well, one thing that really stands out to me, though, is just a big show. Don't tell note of they basically say if the Nazis get the holy grail, they kind of indicate now they'll be able to have these. Nazi super soldiers that can't die. But they were just like, that's as a viewer. I'd never buying that. No, that's the thing with Raiders. And they just say it with Raiders. There's this kind of there is this more gripping like we both.

[01:30:53] We have someone's going to get to this weird thing first and Lord knows what's in it. But like the Nazis have designs on its power with the holy grail. Right. There's this sort of like, well, what if someone got the holy grail? I'm like, what if someone got what do you mean that he lives forever? Like, okay, one guy like I mean, you're gonna have like your whole army come drink from the Holy. Like at this point. And then of course they get there and it's like, yeah, you can live forever if you stay right the fuck here in this place and you cannot leave. You can't cross the seal. Yeah, you can't cross the seal.

[01:31:23] But like that's the grail myth is always that. Let me know when it's time to start talking about that scene. I don't want to step on toes. The grail myth is, you know, in Arthurian legend all the way to this. It's always right. It's like, oh, well, that would be great. And then you get there and you're like, I guess I didn't think hard about why this would be great because it's not great. Like this wasn't worth it. And the journey is the destination. Yeah, the destination is the journey and all that. Ties back into the Nazi thing though, because how much of it, there's also something fascinating

[01:31:47] in pseudo watch of like, hey, prominent Jewish filmmaker dealing with Nazis. Also, it's a movie that presupposes that Christian mythology is happening, that there is a holy grail that has magical powers. Right. The original Raiders is Old Testament. It is far more rabbinical in like the nature. Raiders is Jewish. Right. Temple is Hindu. This is Christian. There's like a thing. There's like a.

[01:32:17] Choices are made. Choices are made. And then Temple of Crystal Skull kind of. I mean, this is the thing that people always point out of like the disconnect between the original trilogy and the two later old man indie movies more than anything is like the first three are all about like, I don't believe in religion. Right. It's like the supernatural, but through specifically the prism of religious. I believe in these artifacts that people cared about and hid away. And like there's, you know, runic languages and there. But I don't actually think that the holy grail is going to keep me alive. But you're close.

[01:32:46] And every fucking time it's like, oh, it keeps you alive. Right. Specific religious stories that, you know, like versus the latter two are like, there's a thing he may or may not believe in, but it's a lot fudgier of like a time travel device or aliens. This movie is like it benefits from being like, yeah, fucking a three and legend. That's like so baked in. But it does almost feel like it gets to the end. And even Spielberg himself is kind of like, I guess you drink from the holy grail.

[01:33:14] Like it feels like a guy who has no, certainly no investment. The end of this movie is so goofy. And I think it works. Oh, it's so good. It's like on paper. You're just like, this is this grill. Really silly. When do we talk about the grail? Okay. With the River Phoenix sequence. River Phoenix stuff. Which feels like Spielberg dusting off the cobwebs and being like, you want fun Spielberg. Here's fun Spielberg. They're on top of a fucking circus train. Which is right. All the way back.

[01:33:41] All the way back to, you know, the greatest show on earth, the big circus train sequence and that were the first cinematic sequence that impacted him. But he's also just loading like everything up. He's like, I'm going to give you all the fun. When you're on top of a moving train that has animals inside of it. If you ask me like, what's the big set piece chase transportation thing in the last crusade? In my mind, as a fan, since I'm nine, I go, oh, the tank one. And then you rewatch it. You're like, they got a train motorcycle motorcycle sidecar.

[01:34:11] They got a plant blimp. Blimp blimp blimp. They got a whole blimpy plot. Then the, then the, then the, then the, then the planes. This movie is arguably about transportation. You're locking David back in. He's leaning in. I hear what you're saying. Transportation infrastructure. It's a love letter to the history of transportation. And camels. Cindy doesn't like camels. I mean, there is a running theme though of like nature's vehicle. Hey, rats come and help you. Horses come and help you. Like the rats help. I guess they sort of.

[01:34:40] Well, the rats give them the heads up that the fire is on the way. Right. The running rats. The rats are pointedly not. There is very. Nazi cooperators. It's also like, Hey, the Nazis have all this tech, but animals like Indiana Jones. He's a more. Well, and just like Indy uses a gun. He will use a gun, but it's not really his primary thing. Inelegant. It's like a blaster. Yeah. Random and elegant.

[01:35:07] No, but like, cause like, cause when I'm now playing the Indiana Jones video game, which has been, I've been meaning to ask, which is really, really good. Yeah. And in that game, you don't have a gun initially, you know, you can get one. It's not like again, but it's sort of like, right. You're like, no, Indy has like a whip and he like picks shit up and, you know, improvises, right? Like he'll have a shovel or like a statue or something. That's what we like about him. Exactly. He's on the back of his heels. Right. And, um, you know, he just needs his, uh, his whip, his fedora.

[01:35:36] I mean, is it a little cute than in the, uh, uh, river Phoenix sequence? It ends with like the sort of Indiana Jones type guy being like, all right, take my hat. You lost today, kid. You know, you have to like it. Is that, yeah. Yeah. Um, is that a little too cute? Am I just kind of sick of that stuff? Because now it's the backbone of all these legacy. I get joy though. No, I enjoy this movie. I get joy going home. But doesn't it makes it makes you think a little bit.

[01:36:05] I mean about like, I always wanted to know where he got his jacket and you know. No, no. I will agree with you that it is the only moment in the sequence that butts up against being a step too cute for me where I'm like, the guy doesn't have to hand him the hat. I can be like, and then later he bought a hat because he thought it looked cool on that guy. But Spielberg likes to put a period on things. But I also like that that sequence ends with like, here's this like thrilling adventure and he's like starting to develop his love for like, you know, this whole way of

[01:36:34] life and the like, you know, finding a different way to express his love and respect for history and these objects than his father who's more purely academic. Although it's also funny to realize too. And I'm sure this is something that I have a blind spot to. I occasionally don't realize there's already internet dialogues about things, but he's a really terrible archaeologist. Have we discussed this? This was part of your text. He's really, really, really bad at being an archaeologist.

[01:37:02] Uh, what's your, what's your problem? The cross of Coronado ends with a ship exploding. Like he goes to, he realizes, hey, we got to go through this library to get down to this crypt. And he just takes a fucking metal thing and starts pounding. He do smash. Everything he ever touches in an archaeological sense is lost to time immediately because he explodes it in a ball of fire. Over and over and over again. There's also a couple of times when he's kind of just like, oh, I found this ancient or whatever, you know, he's like blowing on something.

[01:37:31] And I'm like, aren't you supposed to kind of treat these things with air? Everything, everything is destroyed. But you know what? It's the thirties. Maybe a lot of this refined, like, oh no, no, no, put on your gloves, get your little brush out. Maybe that came later. I just feel like everyone in the academic field, when they see Henry Jones Jr.'s name get attached to a case file must just go like, ah, we're, we're fucked. Everything we do will be, will crumble to goddamn dust before we can even take a photograph of it. Cause this asshole has to smash everything and make it explode.

[01:38:01] Your text, when you put forth your choice of last crusade, my favorite thing about last crusade is that Indiana Jones is the worst archeologist of all time. Really terrible at it. The Venice, the Venice crypt scene is, we located one of the brothers, great, the first crusader night. But before anyone else knows about it, we climb, climb out of the sewage system and it's gone forever. Your followup text within seconds of finding the actual tombs and graves of real Templar nights.

[01:38:29] They are engulfed in fire bombs. He makes the rubbing. He's very bad at it. He gets what he needs and then it explodes. I mean, to be fair. Everything he finds is immediately destroyed. And it's so funny to watch the movie with that in mind. Yeah. He's bad at archeology. Uh, really bad. Well, it's cause he has Steven Spielberg, like crafting inventive action sequences around him. Okay. He'd love to probably just be chill. I just don't believe he'd ever get to a professor level at a university behaving this way. The people are massing in his office waiting for office hours.

[01:38:59] And shit on the balance. I find that to be one of the biggest logical reaches of this entire film. It is funny that it's like, okay, we have the opening sequence and then we, we tie, you know, we, we jump forward in time and we sort of, I just want to close the lip on that. I just want to say, I like that that sequence. It's like he rushes home. He's got it. He thinks his dad's going to love it. Right. Connery. We don't even show an actor playing young Connery. You hear the voice. He's dismissive. And then it's like cops show up. Cops are in bed with these people. They make them give it back.

[01:39:26] We have six witnesses and he sees this fucking fat cat out the window. And it's like system is right. Like he's in a microcosm. He's got this excitement of feeling like I've done it. I've won and I'm going to have my dad's respect. And it's like your dad doesn't give a shit. And this fucking lifestyle is going to be a grind. It's going to be uphill battle the rest of your life against these fucking dudes with the nice suits and the money. And then I just like that a hard cut, hard cuts to him on the ship in the rain.

[01:39:54] And he's still trying to get this one object from this one guy. It's what makes it feel not disconnected as a mini movie is it's like, oh, the reason we're seeing this now is because this is about how much Indiana Jones can't get over shit. But you know, in archaeology, if you go to a museum to display something, they're going to say like, OK, so where did you find it? And he's going to look him in the eye and go, what? I murdered the entire crew of the ship. Well, so that's the thing.

[01:40:24] I murdered everyone on a ship. He didn't mean to. He just meant to get the cross, but their ship goes explode. But archaeology wise, this is bad form in the field of archaeology. I do just- I murdered a bunch of people and now I have this cross. I do just like that Indy has this basically unseen adventure that we just see the final minutes of on the boat, him getting the cross back, right. He goes back and he is finally like, I'm going to fucking teach my class. I'm going to do my office hours, right?

[01:40:52] Like I'm not no more like pending adventures. I'm over. Tied that thing off. Closed loop. I'm going to have these horny girls. Yeah. Take a number. I'll see every single person. It's fine. You know, hey, dental Elliot. How you doing? High five. Like, you know, and gets a weird package, right? He's like, yeah, weird package. But you know what? No, he's at least- I- it doesn't feel forced to me that Indy is trying to be a college professor for a second.

[01:41:19] I think he's so bad at it that there would be- he would honestly probably be- his name and photo would be circulated in college archaeology departments worldwide of do not hire this lunatic. His rate my professor score would be- This lunatic. He's hot. He's fantastic at locating artifacts. Unfortunately, instantly destroys them every single time. I agree with you that he thinks- He's bad at it. He's bad at it.

[01:41:46] I can hang up the fucking hat and teach full time and I'm good and I closed the last like big narrative arc in my life, which was getting that fucking cross. And now I'm here. If he hadn't gotten the delivery from Donovan, he would have in two weeks started going crazy and being like, give me that fucking whip back. But he's convincing himself he's ready to like move on. And much like he couldn't fucking move on until he closes the loop on the cross thing, getting the grail diary and being like, fuck, that's my dad's shit.

[01:42:15] He goes to see Walter Donovan Walter on and he's like, grail, grail, grail. He's like, right, that's my dad's obsession. Call him. I did call him. He's missing. Okay. There's this- he doesn't really want to do this. It's a little bit more the obligation of like, well, if my fucking dad is missing, right, I guess I have to put the effort in. And I think it's almost less about saving his dad than it is about impressing his dad. Right. Like he's like, if I show up, he's gonna be like good shit kid.

[01:42:43] Um, so, right, the next sequence is Venice, is the- is the catacombs and the introduction of Elsa. Great sequence. Dr. Schneider. Kazum. Kazum is there. Yes, that's true. Great sequence. The rats are the special effect that no one would ever bother with anymore. Yep. Like that would be CGI now. Spielberg gets 2,000 fucking wet rats and makes everyone like deal with them. Ben just perked up. It looks amazing. Wait, say more.

[01:43:12] 2,000 wet rats. Now, has anyone ever attempted that at New York Fashion Week, Ben? That's a great question. Not to force an ambition on you. Yeah. Damn. But has anyone ever had 2,000 wet rats on a runway? I don't like this. I don't know. I think there is maybe some ASPCA issues there, but- Yeah, and also some, you know, public health hygiene. Bubonic plague. Right, because they are currently fighting against rats. Right, we don't want like- but maybe he got them all in one place. Yeah. To be dealt with. Sure.

[01:43:42] Um- Can I say, old librarian who thinks his stamp is weirdly loud? I think that is so fun. This is- This is the shit- Quality gag. That makes this my favorite of the movie is where I'm like, that is such a griffin bit. I think it's- Yeah, I think it's- The reaction stops. Huh? It's a classic rule of three thingy of like, it's funny once and by the time it's been like extended for a while, we're just like, I'm just like, I love the librarian. But, and the choice that it isn't like, oh, this guy's oblivious. It's-

[01:44:09] He's not hearing the sound because of the stamp, that it starts to become this little tiny mini story of this guy being like, look, am I incredible at stamping shit? Also- Am I the most powerful man alive? Also, the type of proof that shows why casting directors deserve Oscars. Yep. Because- Yeah, that guy's got a funny face. You need an appropriately weird looking guy to play a befuddled librarian. And go on this little arc of like, he's starting to feel himself. You know, like this guy needs to be able to really act.

[01:44:39] You can't just pick a funny looking guy. No, and that character grew and changed by the end of the film. He did! As much as any other. He goes on a journey! He does. Now, help me out here. They learn, okay, we found the tomb, Henry's being held at this castle. Here's the root to the grail, the diary, all this stuff. This is when Elsa's room has been ransacked, which we later learned she does. Is she doing that just to get in Indy's bed and like kind of win his trust?

[01:45:07] Or is there like a deeper conspiracy here that I don't- I think it's, she really wants the grail diary. Right. And if she trashes her room too, he'll never suspect that she went and rooted around his room. But I also think it's part of her playbook. She wants to seduce him or make him think that he is seducing her so that there is a guard down perhaps as well. Yeah. I think it's all part of the same pie.

[01:45:35] The castle sequence, somewhat underrated I would say in Indiana Jones. I agree. I'm hearing you say you're like sort of, I don't want to put words in your mouth, but like a little underwhelmed perhaps compared to Raiders. No, I like this movie a lot. But I'm like, it's really only the third act that whiffs. Almost everything else is like a fun advantage. You think the third act of this movie whiffs? Only in the sense that like the grail does- I love that. I love that. I feel like you were the one who was kind of saying like there's stuff about the end that I don't buy the stakes and the grail and whatever.

[01:46:04] I do think every single set piece is so fucking strong. This is fucking great. And there are like five of them. Yeah. My whole thing with this movie is that it is basically whatever. Spielberg is like Barry Bonds of like a high school game. Right. Like where it's like he can do this shit so good at this point. He's done it. He's it almost feels like George Lucas is like make my third any movie. He's like, bam, I just made it. Fuck you. I can do anything. And he does always the same year, which is not as good. But he's like, not only can I make your third indie movie like that.

[01:46:33] Yeah, I can make it and then immediately make another make it in two months. Whatever. Like five amazing set pieces. Like, fuck you. He's just becoming a machine at this point. And so there's a yeah, like a slight I there's just something about this movie. I I'm always every time I watch it. I'm like, this is so fun. Everyone's having a good time. Maybe it's just a little weightless to me. I like the Connery stuff, obviously, because it's great.

[01:47:00] I like Connery Connery's reaction of the tank going over to the cliff adds like a full star to the real for me. And it's because I'm like, that's really just enough for me in terms of like weight, emotional weight. Otherwise, what is this movie about? I don't know. But that's a motorcycle with a sidecar. Yeah, they're like Rangers of the Lost Ark, I think is so brilliant and scary. And like the shadow of the Nazis hanging over it in such an interesting way. It's a better movie. It's so cool. And a deeper film.

[01:47:29] Temple of Doom is like massively flawed. I think so. But it's this is one of those series where like, I don't remember. Like I saw them all when I was a kid. They were never my movies. Like I was always a Star Wars kid more than like I was an indie kid, I guess. So I don't have like a deep like obsessive love of. I wonder how often because also I know I know Temple does not hold up. But when I was a kid, Temple was pretty beloved.

[01:47:56] And I have I have a feeling for people who grew up while these movies were coming out. Being able to look at them in total afterwards is different. Yeah. I have a feeling that for people who grew up with them, whichever one you saw first is generally your favorite. Yeah, I think that's a classic. Right. For these kinds of things. There is a a whiny piss baby angry nerd YouTuber that I hate watch who I will not get into any more specifics of. But is Indiana Jones is one of his main beats.

[01:48:25] And it's one of those things where he's just like by last crusade, they fucked it up. It's Spielberg doing kiddie shit. It's lost the stakes of like the adventure. There's some argument for it's getting too emotional. I don't like that. Even with Star Wars, my kid, my kid loved right walks. Yeah, it's the thing of like what argument of these things are for families and kids is fine. It's just annoying when then George Lucas is like every complaint directed him. He's like movies for kids move on.

[01:48:55] You know, like this guy. I'm like, you're the age where like you saw Raiders in theaters and it probably blew your mind. And then you were a little older and you saw Temple and you were like, this shit's scary. It's growing up with me. And then by the time you see Last Crusade, you still fucking love Indiana Jones. But for the first time, you're maybe a little bit older than the movie. And he like throws it down a well. And he talks about he spent so much time talking about like how they fucked up the Indiana Jones franchise and how it's his most beloved character.

[01:49:25] And I'm like, you like two out of the five movies. At this point, you dislike more Indiana Jones than you'd like. Like you just have to accept it. Like you can just say, I love these two films. But at a certain point, if you're fighting against that much of the franchise, you're denying what it is. You don't enjoy. Right. Why even care? The castle is great. It's great. He sets the car. His kid doesn't know. They realize that they slept with the same girl. The fucking Scooby Doo revolving door. That's great.

[01:49:54] But like Ford doing the Scottish accent. You know, Ford having a little bit of, you know, like character fun. And comedy chops. But then also the guy calling it out. If you're a Scottish lord, I'm a blah, blah, blah. Like it's fun. Which also much like Spielberg, it's like Ford in between these movies did some more grown up shit. You feel him being like, you know what? It would be fun to just punch some guys and do some silly voices. I want to be Indiana Jones again.

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[01:52:18] That's code factor podcast at factor meals.com slash factor podcast to get 50% off plus free shipping on your first box. Jumping ahead a little bit, but another what I assume is the stopper line that I think is incredibly good is when they're fighting about Indiana Jones's feeling of like indifference to him that he felt as a child, right?

[01:52:46] And like his like refusal to engage after your mom left all this sort of shit. We haven't talked in 20 years because of you. And Connery, one of his defensive lines is, well, you moved out just as you were starting to get interesting. Yeah. This thing of like, it's a bit of a brutal one. I have no interest in talking to children. And the second you start to become an adult, you moved out and it's like, yeah, that's how it fucking works. You didn't want to be a dad. But do the work. There's also something to be said.

[01:53:12] Like, I think that there is truth to the kids perspective of that. But I also think there is something quietly super fucking real about you understand your dad more when you've been through some stuff. And when you were a kid and you get old enough to understand, like, especially back then historically, like maybe a dad was gone all the time. And that's the reason you had food and a house to sleep in.

[01:53:40] And a lot of families need the dad back then. But the dad clearly, he didn't deal with the loss of his wife very well. But that emotionally, like, I don't know. And some of this obviously relates to conversations I had with my dad. But I'm like, I remember having a conversation with my dad once asked me, my dad once said to me, I always liked calling you when we moved houses because you and I were really good about packing up a truck.

[01:54:07] And I remember saying to him, yeah, I remember during one of those days, it was the first time I felt like I could let my guard down and really, like, talk to you. And seeing my dad had this heartbroken look on his face. And he's like, wait, you were almost 30 at the time that you're talking about. And I was like, yeah. And he was like, you didn't feel like you could let your guard down around me until you were 30. And it was heartbreaking. But when I watched that moment of him being like, you were just getting interesting.

[01:54:37] I'm like, I don't excuse any of it in Henry Jones, senior or my father. But I'm like, some time like that's real. That's real. That's so real. This is why also the Eskimo brothers thing, even if it comes out of like a horny, I still need to be an alpha Connery note. And it's mostly played as a joke. There's something about this movie in the second half forcing them to become contemporaries. That's why it works. Right. It's real.

[01:55:05] It's just like he's seeing things from a different vantage point because he and his dad are now doing the exact same shit in lockstep. They're on the same adventure. They're in the same action sequences. They're after the same goal keeping each other alive. Like I'm nothing like you. I spent my entire life trying to be that fucking guy named Fedora on the train. And it's like, no, you're doing my shit in different clothes. A little bit.

[01:55:28] Um, and I think, uh, senior comes to take his son more seriously because he watches him in action mode, which is something he doesn't do. Right? Like senior doesn't do action mode. Yeah. He's watching his son actually be in action mode. But there's a lovely moment of Ford watching Connery chase the birds away with his umbrella. The birds is a really fascinating moment. And being like, my dad's just some guy. Like, I feel like I've heard you talk about a lot in different circumstances.

[01:55:58] Your realization at some age as a nerd that your father knew the names of the members of the Fantastic Four. And being like, my dad is like a serious grownup who has a job and has no interest in my like childish bullshit. Right. And then being like, not only were you into these characters when you were my age, you still remember what their names are. This is in your head. You know, there's like that part of it of being like, he's seeing kind of the little boy version of his dad in that moment.

[01:56:29] I think the hat's just crucial too. I think, I think for the character. Yeah. The Henry Jones senior has such a silly hat. His look is incredible. Being like, don't forget my hat. In the same way that his son does, but his son has a cool hat. I think what I'm realizing as we talk it out loud is, and some of this is Sean Connery's performance. Some of this is in the script, but I'm, I, I go, I will say, and David, I respect your opinions on film far more than my own.

[01:56:55] But I go, the dad, son stuff in this movie, I think actually does make it significantly more than just it moves from set piece to set piece in a way that. But, but that doesn't start till halfway through once he shows up in the movie is, but I like that. I mean, it's like if the second half of this movie were a flipped mirror image of the first half and the dad thing was not part of it, it would be like, yeah, this is just Spielberg showing off that he can do great sequences.

[01:57:23] I do like that the movie has this kind of like sneaky turn into thematic weight. And the weight is characterization, which is basically the thing that is avoided in the first two Indiana Jones movies. There was characterization, but we're not really digging into the psychology of Indiana Jones. He's a character defined by action. And there's the sense of his relationships to these people. But it's like, I'm just fucking moving forward. And his dad's the only person who can get him to stop and have to like reckon with shit.

[01:57:52] And it's why I like starting with him as a little kid again, because you're just like, this guy isn't mythical. He's a dude. And like everything that's cool about him is like all of us, a direct result of who he was raised by, right? For both good and bad. It also recontextualizes every other Indiana Jones movie now with the thing of like, this guy's chasing his dad. And after you watch this one, you know that when you rewatch the other ones. Yeah. Yeah. It's certainly, especially Raiders.

[01:58:20] Temple of Doom is a strange movie to think about in any sense, but you know, and he's helping these kids in Temple, I guess there's the somewhat fatherly thing with him in short round, you know, like, I'm not saying that all of a sudden this turns into like a psychological breakdown of the characters that never got the credit it's due. But I do think this movie is more than set piece to set piece because of that exact stuff. No, I agree. Once Sean Connery shows up, it's yes. I agree with what you're saying for the prism of like Spielberg is just a few years away

[01:58:49] from leveling up to being able to tell really complicated, mature adult psycho emotional stories. And like in that context, you're just like, aren't you ready to move on from this? Even if this film has like emotional weight and something to say about like fathers and sons and whatever, it's still doing that in a very pop candy coated way. And like, aren't we ready to like level up to a certain degree?

[01:59:13] But I think this is like the last time for me that he kind of has this right balance of doing this. There's a moment to kill a mockingbird. I believe it does not make the film, but where Atticus shoots this rabid dog. And in the process, one of his glasses lenses breaks and then he like reaches down with his heel and just grinds out the glass. So it's not sharp and nobody gets cut on it, gets cut on it. He walks away and Jem is amazed.

[01:59:41] And he's like, I can't believe my dad was the one that you guys all had take the shot. And one of the neighbors is like, do you not know that your daddy is the best shot in the county? And everyone's known that for fucking decades. And it's, and the sheriff is specifically a bad shot. The sheriff is like, we need Atticus. And they're like, why do you want our stuffy lawyer dad to do this? And he's like fucking Mr. Gone. Did you not know your dad is a fucking bad? And that Indiana, like the last crusade is a movie length exploration of the idea of

[02:00:08] like, hey, all this shit you don't know about your dad might just fill in some of the emotional gaps that a whole generation of fathers ravaged their sons with. And what you just said will basically always get me like even in the worst executions of that when I don't respect it intellectually, I'd be like they are playing with like powerful materials there. It's always going to stir a little something in me and like being able to do it pretty well

[02:00:37] in a movie that also delivers good fucking bits and like five of the best directed action sequences you've ever seen. I'm just like, yeah, this is like a perfect movie movie for that. Listen, field of dreams, then playing catch. We were talking about right before this record. Never not make me cry. Yep. And I couldn't give less of a shit about baseball. And yet I watch that and I'm like baseball is the most important thing that's ever. You know, when they're throwing the ball around, I'm like, absolutely baseball.

[02:01:07] Archie Moonlight Graham is the Fistoa field of dreams. Now, that is a good take that I have no objection to. I think Archie Moonlight Graham is more important than Fistoa. What the fuck are you saying? That's so mean to get Fistoa. The horn is actually the most offensive word you could have used in that second line. And I'm the bad boy in Flaid Jack. My whole problem with Kit Fisto is that Palpatine just, you know. The whole problem with Kit Fisto is that there are no problems with the character. That's a horrible way to start. That's a good point.

[02:01:35] The whole problem with Kit Fisto is that characters should have weaknesses and flaws and he doesn't. But that's why I just hate. I just, I mean, I hate Revenge of the Sith. I always will. I won't be, you know, turned around by people being like, oh, it's about the fall of Rome and shit. And I'm like, yeah, I know it is, but it's not a good version of all this. David, I'm just going to give you some advice. Don't go on blank check and say you hate an individual Star Wars movie because it could turn into a thing for you. And the fire turns into a thing for you.

[02:02:04] But like, you know, Mace Windu just shows up. And he's like, I'll bring three of my best guys. Yeah, the Jedi wrecking crew. Exactly. And Palpatine, who is one billion years old. I got such a good surprise for you for the end of this episode, by the way. Alright, alright, well then let's move on to the Zeppelin scene. Would you not watch a whole Archie Moonlight Graham prequel to Field of Dreams? Sounds pretty cool. And do you know that Archie Graham Moonlight can hold his breath underwater and he can smell fear?

[02:02:30] And he's gotta be getting home so Alicia doesn't think he's got himself a girlfriend. The Zeppelin scene. Great. Anytime I see a Zeppelin, which is not that often in the movie. No, not a lot. You are kind of like, it's too bad this didn't work out. Because it does kind of seem nice, right? Where they're just like, it's just like a big ass restaurant essentially. What a nice thing to see up in the sky. There's rumors that are coming back. The delivery service. I heard that.

[02:02:57] And that's like a reminder of like, wait, this is actually though, uh, technology that there's a reason why we don't utilize it anymore. There's rumors they're bringing them back. I think it's time. I think it's time. I think it's time. Environmental impact for short flights. Let's go back to Zeppelin. But aren't we running out of helium? Isn't that a thing? That's a great question. Which is gonna, I mean, just be fucking murder for the industry of doing funny voices. I know.

[02:03:21] We talk about this in next week's episode, but I think they just don't go that fast, right? Isn't that part of the problem with Zeppelins? Great. Let's slow down. Let's enjoy ourselves. Sure. Let's just smell the roses. Can we just turn off our phones and float in the sky? This is what I'm saying. We're all so addicted to our phones, I say as I spin the Disney Moji Blitz wheel on two different devices. There's a very- So I can get double jams. I would say there is a very funny, consistent thing that I'm not nitpicking in Last Crusade though,

[02:03:47] but it shows up in the Zeppelin scene very prominently is a bunch of things that are so joyous, funny, awesome moments where the aftermath of them just like the- It's the clerk's bit of like, you think about how many contractors are dying. The pacing of the aftermath doesn't add up. My point being like, they punched the Nazi, they throw him, he lands on the big pile of luggage. No tickets. Everyone takes those tickets. Fantastic. Funny gag. Very funny.

[02:04:15] But the idea that the Zeppelin just then slowly floats away and no Nazis react to this high-ranking Nazi landing on a pile of luggage. It's a little, I mean, look. There's a few moments of that in this movie. Again, like the boat explodes and then you're left to go like, okay, and I guess Indiana just grabs that little life thing and swims back to shore. The Zeppelin is tidy. But they do eventually, of course. Oh shit, we're turning around, we're back to Berlin. Yes, maybe it's a little silly. Like, I guess we should use this plane that's right here.

[02:04:43] I said that Spielberg never gets this balance is right again, which of course is me realizing I stupidly am ignoring Jurassic Park. Right? Which is truly the last time he gets the balance right. But that is a movie where, to this point of what you're saying, I think he's starting to realize it here. He's like, my understanding of like movie logic and spatial geography and what the audience sees and doesn't, what I'm like, like a fucking magician. I'm making them look here and not think about this.

[02:05:09] He's starting to like fuck around and be like, I can put together a sequence that doesn't actually make any sense and not make people realize that it doesn't make any sense. You won't give up. A little bit. Jurassic has a ton of that. Just don't overthink it. Which is like very skillful shit. And one of these things too, that it's like I rewatch it now by myself. And then you realize part of the pacing of that feeling weird is because that motherfucker knew the crowd would have been cheering. Yes.

[02:05:38] That a theater full of people is laughing and clapping at the everyone leaving. He's so good at this. And if they're laughing, they're not going to think about the fact where it's like, well, wait a second. The Zeppelin is still only five feet above the sky. They'd have 20 Nazi dudes jumping. It doesn't matter. Right. Doesn't matter. He was pacing it for the fucking applause break that he knew he got. It's like Hamburger had just performed. Hamburger. The crowd is going wild. This is what the tank thing is too, where there, I guess there will come a point, I

[02:06:07] guess in any, you know, where these action movies that these, those kinds of sequences are previs so well that it almost feels too easy. Right? Like, oh, he ducks just when he, but you know, right. But the tank sequence, you're just kind of like, I, I gotta just give it up. Like, you know, like, you know, like, you know, like, yeah, yeah. The thing that still makes Spielberg better at this than anyone else who has ever lived is the exact thing that the sort of like obsessive prevising before the script is done actually

[02:06:34] fights against, which is just like, what are the character moments? What are the moments in this that are going to pop as like a laugh? And it's not because it's a dumb one off joke. It's something that surprises you or someone does something differently than you expect. It reveals something different about themselves. These sequences have their own internal like arcs and peaks and valleys like they're symphonic. And he knows, he knows like, I gotta hold the shot for 30 seconds because if I do something right now, the audience is going to be riding such a high from the last thing.

[02:07:04] They won't be able to process this. His mastery is just insane at this point. It's crazy. I had a very weird thought that ties into this, which I think you guys will enjoy, which is I've been to Hollywood Studios many times. You're saying the Disney park? The Disney park. The Disney park. With the, with the Indiana Jones. The Indiana Jones stunt spectacular. Which is a great show. It's a great little show, but it does this funny thing. Probably my favorite play.

[02:07:32] Edward Albee's Indiana Jones stunt spectacular. Stoppard quietly wrote all the dialogue in Last Crusade and Albee quietly wrote all the dialogue in the Indiana Jones stunt spectacular. But they do that funny thing, which when I was a kid, I loved, which is like they presuppose that you're sitting in these bleachers watching the actual filming of a movie of a seat in action sequence in Indiana Jones. And then I get old and I wind up being lucky enough to be an actor who has been on some

[02:07:58] film sets largely cut out of films as our dash, our slash blankies has, has danced on, but cut out of some big ass movies, but cut out of some huge movies. Also proud of my career. Anyway, and have remained in the great films. Thank you so much. Making a joke referencing my past chicanery on your show. By the way, same thing with me. My biggest credits on paper of the biggest movies I've been in are all the ones I've been cut out of. It's how it fucking goes. Also a sign of a quality career. It's fine. We're workers. We're workers.

[02:08:27] But you go to it as an actor to the stunt show and you're like, ah, that's not how movies really work. And it's silly. They're pretending this is a movie. And then you rewatch an Indiana Jones movie and you're like, I bet Steven Spielberg was running this set way closer to the actual tenor and tone of the Indiana Jones stunt spectacular at Hollywood studios than any other movies. He does seem like he actually runs a set that cleanly, especially again, people, there are just no complaints from this. Now Raiders. That was hard.

[02:08:56] Everyone gets desentary. It's crazy. You should go. Jaws was hard. By now it's kind of just like, nah, he's just completely in charge of this shit. I bet there are fucking crazy amounts of trucks and scaffolding and cranes and shit and things flipping up and people diving off of buildings and doing flips. Like all that shit they show at the stunt spectacular. I'm like, I am willing to buy into the kayfabe that a Steven Spielberg set is actually as fun and crazy as that stunt spectacular. I think so. That's kind of all you hear from people who work on his movies.

[02:09:26] I do think we mentioned it already, but I do think, you know, Connery's reaction to the tank going over the way he just like simply and quickly plays. He knows all the entire after he knows all the action though, right? The brothers of the sort have come back. There's people fighting on the tank and on top of the tank tracks, the way rescued from the tank treads, Indy holding his dad's leg with the whip as his dad bounced on the tank and he's literally riding shotgun in this entire action sequence.

[02:09:55] And he's like, yawn, who cares? The crazy tank guy. You mentioned Holdren's shit. You also mentioned before, like the Indiana Jones habit of just like this guy is the blank, the tank pilot with that crazy leather hat and goggles. Like it's so fun. And he just didn't think his son was going to die. And obviously he doesn't die. But like Connery has that just that moment of like, of shit. And he convinces us. He convinces us we get to see his reaction. Like it's actually, fuck, I actually didn't get to tell him like all these things I meant to tell him.

[02:10:23] Which here's another thing that quietly belies. It'll take in five minutes. Him being so shocked at the idea that Indiana Jones died does quietly speak to a level of respect he has for what he would never have said out loud. Right. Because he's like, I know my son goes off on all these stupid fucking adventures and he's going through like pitfalls and traps and shit. I never worry he's going to die. Right. I know that's why I've been putting off the five great at being Indiana Jones.

[02:10:52] I hear he's off in some fucking Peruvian like booby trapped, you know, temple. Yeah, I don't think I should have called him and said, hey, I love you before he goes off. So that all happens. Now, to me, the emotional arcs of this movie are pretty much resolved. And it's time for a wonderful like LucasArts video game point and click adventure like in that sequence, which is the grail. Am I counterpoint to that?

[02:11:20] The puzzles of the grail and then the emotional puzzle of the night, you know, my counterpoint to that, which is what I said earlier, which is him having to do it alone and revealing how much he has ingested of what his father's of his father's work does add a new wrinkle onto the emotional closure. I agree with you that it's like they've gotten to the place where they can admit to each other that they love each other. There is still this one added step of like, I'm more like my dad than I realized every all of his life's work is in my bones.

[02:11:50] And every kid. And I felt this with my dad. Spielberg clearly felt it with his just that feeling of like the sting of like, why didn't my dad ever slow down and have that five minute conversation with me is also coupled with why does every son assume that his father hasn't actually thought hard about who he is and why he's behaving and how it relates to his son. And you're like, Ooh, and then to immediately follow it up with like, he just

[02:12:21] fought a tank by hand saved you in the process, fell off a fucking cliff. And it's like, you have the one moment of emotion that you share. And then he collapses from exhaustion and you go, no, get the fuck up. We got to get back to work. We're almost at the end is like, God damn. And it's right back into it. But now we understand each other is like the dad has to go through his arc of like, fuck. What would my regrets have been if that was the last time I ever saw you?

[02:12:48] Now Indian Jones is on the flip side of that, which is like his dad's been fucking shot. And the stakes of this now like fucking Tomb Raider level he has to go through is if I fuck this up and I don't do it in time, my dad's dead. And we're now at the stage of life where the son takes care of the. Correct. Thank you. Yeah. Move forward. Break, break, break, break, break, break. You are never, ever, ever, ever concerned that he's not going to. He's going to do it as an audience member. No, but those are the stakes for Indiana Jones, the character. That's why he still has unresolved shit.

[02:13:18] It's fine. You know, he's going to do it. He has to trust his dad. He has to trust his dad. Take the leap of faith and all that. Which would have been so much is I think all that stuff is great. The you know, the puzzle solving stuff is so cool. The, the, the floor with the Jehovah, the leap of faith is the coolest thing. What's the misspelling? What's the misspelling? What's the? Oh, just the right. Jehovah starts with a hole. But the, the, but dodging the blades. Then he gets to the grail. Now let's discuss this sequence.

[02:13:46] It's a, it's a fountain or whatever. A pool, a pool of water. A water font. The holy water thing you see at the front. Every church. It's a knight in knightly armor, chain mail. It's old ass dude. He's very old. This mother has been there for 700 years. He's been there 700 years. Not even a crossword puzzle. No magazine. This guy can't do Wordle every day. I have the same thought. 700 fucking years. He's been sitting around and these assholes ruin it. If he went through the text history.

[02:14:16] If he had Wordle, how many times would he have gone through like all of the words Wordle, right? Like it's like there's like a limited amount of Wordle words. Like five, five years. Not to mention this guy's getting like queen bee every day. 700 years. He's getting spanogram and strands. He's eating whatever they can't eat. He's fucking, probably jerking off relentlessly. He doesn't have fucking pop ramen. Do you think he jerks off? This guy! This guy! This guy! Do you think he jerks off? Wait, here's, here's my question. He's a religious man.

[02:14:43] Do you think every day he picks a new cup to jerk off to? Cause like that's the only thing he can look at. This fucking guy for seven, they say it's 700 years of silence sitting there. Guys, I'm sorry. These- Breaking news. Yeah. I was just sent two texts from my father. This is breaking news. Do you know what I'm about to say? He's gonna tell you he loves you for the first time. This is big. From Peter Newman. Deadline link. Draft day feature to be adapted for TV.

[02:15:12] Oh, I did, I did, I did just uh, yep. With a basketball twist. And my dad says, time to bring back Rick the Inter. I mean, get him in there. Is, is uh... You didn't tell me this fucking news and you read it? It just, it just noticed it. Can't trust this guy. Is Rick all grown up? These are the questions I hope they're asking. Is it, um, you know, is this like, uh, the fucking Suits LA? Where it's like, oh, it's Suits LA. Does it have any of the guys from Suits LA? They're like, no, it's just like a legal show set in LA. We're just calling it Suits.

[02:15:42] Like, is Costner involved? You know, like, do we have, you know- I don't know, let me be the one fucking legacy character. That's what I'm saying. I never thought I'd say this, but guys, we're at the grail night scene and we need to focus on. This is what I wanted to say. I thought the thing I've been promising to recite back to you was in text. Then I looked, the text exchange was the he's a bad archaeologist. The thing you said was said in person, I believe at the, the Gether 10th anniversary show. Oh, the reunion show.

[02:16:12] The reunion show, which was such a wonderful night. You said this to me backstage where I said like, hey, and we'll do Last Crusade in like a couple months. 10th anniversary group. 15. 15. You're right. This show is 10. That's 15. So, excuse me while I paraphrase this. This is fucking grail night. But you said to me something to the effect of, I think one of the funniest bits of all time is this guy being in this fucking cave. 700 years. 700 years with nothing.

[02:16:40] And Indiana Jones showing up and immediately fucking up his entire life. Just like he fucked up the catacomb under Venice. He fucked up the cross of Colorado. But it's so personal for this guy. This fucking guy for 700 years has been like, where's the next night that's going to come take over? Indiana Jones comes. He doesn't even allow the guy to finish explaining. Hey man, finally, you don't look like a knight. And Indiana Jones straight up cuts him off and is like, eh, not my thing, man. That's not really how this is about.

[02:17:08] And then before he can finish his sentence, the Nazis come, pick the wrong cup. That guy turns into fucking a Beetlejuice guy right there. It's weirdly scary. Yeah. Yeah. Then Elsa is all fucked up. Yeah. She drops the thing because she just straight up can't even listen for 10 fucking her ADHD. He's like, just don't take it past the thing. She takes it past the thing. We got the earthquakes.

[02:17:32] And then I think the, one of the saddest and also funniest moments in maybe all of cinematic history is that guy gives a sad little wave. Bye. He's been waiting 700 years and two minutes later, this asshole Indiana Jones find it. This movie has three beats. The cross of Coronado, he makes everything explode. The fucking Templar Knight's grave, he makes it explode.

[02:18:02] He finally finds the Holy Grail. He fucks that up too. In your words, maybe the funniest bit of all time. That little wave that knight gives is so sad and so funny. Okay. But what is happening to that knight, do you think? He wants to, he's been praying for death. No, no, no, I'm saying, I'm saying, well, no, of course, I know. But I'm saying like, the, because of all the stuff that happened. He's been praying for death for like 694 years.

[02:18:27] We are to assume that he has drank from the correct cup centuries earlier and he gets to live forever. And that's the curse of live forever but you have to wake him. And he can finally get the sweet release of a well-earned death. Move on. Here's my question. Indy comes in. All right, and let's just go through what happens. Indy comes in. Yeah. Right. He's kind of like, I don't know, man. I kind of just need to save my dad. Nazis come in. This is a moment I just think we have to touch on.

[02:18:56] The knight's like, okay, we'll choose a fucking cup. Be careful. I'm just texting my manager the draft day link. Elsa is like, let me choose. Julian Glover's like, yeah, sounds good. She does it on purpose, right? I assume what she's doing is on purpose, right? They make eye contact. Yeah, yeah. So nonetheless, how fucking dumb is Julian Glover? That he's like, yeah, you know what? Actually, you pick. And she's like, literally just goes like this one. Like she doesn't even walk the length of the cups. She just kind of grabs one. This is my point though.

[02:19:26] It's like, he is just some dumb dork. No, no, no. He could have walked over to that old ass knight, grabbed his nuts and twisted them and been like, tell me which one. Ask a couple questions. Just take a cursory glance. Tell me which one, you weird old man. Instead he's like, ah, it looks great. It's gold. You're on Kruger's syndrome. This guy thinks he knows everything. We're blowing past the part where Indiana Jones is like, who are you? And he's like, I'm one of three brothers. And Indiana Jones straight up is like, oh, so you're 700 years old. Anyway, man, I'm kind of not into this.

[02:19:58] This is not really my scene. I love this movie so much, but the end is like, Indy has the, I need to save my dad. This act, this deadbeat sort of is like playing Mousetrap. Everything is like, now this, now this, now this, now this. To be fair, Spielberg said when Lucas initially pitched him the Holy Grail, Spielberg was like, is there anything fun you can do with the ending of the Holy Grail? Like, is there enough, is there like a special effects thing you can do? Like what's the, he was a little concerned, like, is it a little boring at the end?

[02:20:25] I think that this ending is so iconic and well regarded. They figured it out. And obviously the special effects thing they figured out was the rapid aging is cool, right? Like that will do that. But everything that's, it's just like the only time pressure is on Indy, which is I want to save my dad. There's no time pressure on Julian Glover. He could just like really kind of be like, I'm going to take a look at every single cup.

[02:20:50] He could just go save your dad so I know which one is the right one. That's an option for him? There's a lot of options for him. Anyway. Some would actually say that's why he shot the dad. But he's just like glug glug glug, Beetlejuice. I love it. I mean, I love it. I love him turning into Beetlejuice. Meanwhile, this knight, who let's remember this whole thing was, he was the most pure one. So his two brothers, he was like, they failed. Goodbye, my brothers. We will never see each other again. Survival of the fittest. He is the one.

[02:21:18] He assumes I'm the first link in a chain where other knights will achieve this, take over, and it will last for eternity. And instead, the first guy who shows up fucks it all up and he just goes, I guess I could have been fucking and eating cheeseburgers for the past fucking 700 years. Because the first asshole to come take over fucked it up. Here's a fun thing to consider. This guy... Indiana Jones sucks as an archaeologist. This guy doesn't even know that movies exist.

[02:21:47] This dude has no idea. He doesn't know that like printed words exist. He doesn't know that Gutenberg invented the printing track. All this shit, cheeseburgers. Let alone about Gutenberg the musical on Broadway. Well, God, and he would have loved that. Dude, he doesn't know about Nintendo. No, he actually does. Weirdly, there's a deleted scene where he's like, I love Nintendo. Yes. Jesus has permitted Nintendo. He has a wooden Nintendo. But you know, this asshole is like, he only had Duck Hunt.

[02:22:15] It wasn't even the double cartridge of Mario Brothers. Oh, he just had the Duck Hunt. His whole life was playing Duck Hunt for 700 years. He had to play with the controller. Yeah. So, okay. So, Julian Glover dies. Julian Glover dying is great. Uh, Indy's like... Indy... Even Indy is a little briskly like, well, I think it's this shitty one. Oh, so smart of you. That's a carpenter's cup. But again, he doesn't even like... I just love him to do one full scan. Just one full scan. Hearing you guys say Spielberg was never particularly interested in the grail or it...

[02:22:45] This, I will say, like, and again, he's given him a million props about his mastery. Mm-hmm. Like, this one does feel like a guy who doesn't give a fuck about this has made it the... Like, the ultimate goal of the movie. And you can sort of feel that he doesn't totally give a fuck about the grail itself. Um... He's done. He's wrapping it up. Cup is proven good. Okay? Takes it to Connery. Saves Connery. That problem is solved. Now it's kind of like, okay, now what do we do? Right?

[02:23:14] And, of course, Elsa takes it across the Great Seal. Which is not Indy's fault. You're disparaging his... He doesn't cause that chaos. That is Elsa's fault. Everywhere he goes in an archeological sense, though, the place explodes or collapses. Um... For three... Crack opens in the earth. Uh... Elsa falls down it. You know, she's... Indy tries to rescue her. She's too tempted by the cup. She falls to her death. Indy resists the temptation of the cup. Gets out. Instead goes with his dad.

[02:23:44] The cup... The grail cup falls into the... Into the abyss, right? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Onto that little ledge. No, but like then... Yeah, that... This is my question. They all leave. Grail Knight, as we know, goes like, uh, bye. Yeah. Right? The whole thing's falling down. Fuck me, I guess. Is Grail Knight still going to live and just kind of be stuck there still? Grail Knight... Is he gonna go get the cup back? Or is the cup gone and Grail Knight's about to die?

[02:24:11] Grail Knight has the craziest choice to make of anyone in the history of Earth, which is like, do I just... No, I... No one else, I guess, cares about this half as much as I thought. Yeah. So I guess now do I stay here and live or... That's my... Like, is the grail lost to him? Walk over the seal and die? I am. Well, there's another option that ties into this, which is that there's another logic, which is so Grail Knight, I, Indiana Jones, this is not my thing.

[02:24:35] But my father has now drank from the cup and conceivably he spent his whole life chasing this and it's actually my father that should be doing this. And my father has sort of lived in absentia in a way that I've always resented. But if it was for the purpose of this, maybe this was the higher purpose, he could stay. And we just watched him drink from the Holy Grail. And they poured it on his tummy. Henry Jones Senior also is like, nah, I got illumination out of it. I got everything I wanted.

[02:25:05] Peace Grail Knight. I'm not even gonna ask you a question. But much like... Yeah, just no further input required. But much like in Rage the Lost Ark, it's like, oh, what's in the ark? And it's like, I don't know, weird ghost, let's get out of here. You know, like, and this one, it's like, oh, what was the mystery of the grail? It's like, I don't fucking know. It fell into a pit. Let's go. Arguably Henry Jones Senior could have stayed there, let the grail knight have the sweet release of death. Marcus Brody could have been sent to any 99 cent store to get one of those little arm extender grabber things.

[02:25:35] A grabbing stick. They could have gone and got one of them grabbers, gotten the... He's taken the grail back and Henry Jones Senior could have taken his turn as the new grail knight. It sucks. It's the worst job in the fucking world. He's dedicated his entire life to this... To finding it. But like, the whole thing with the holy grail is right, you get there and you're like, hell yeah! And it's like, couple of tatch, you know, couple of provisos here. One, you can't leave. Two, uh, no one's here. So it sucks. What do you think the grail knight, like when they were all leaving, he would have been like, no, guys, no, wait, one of you has to take over and they'd be like,

[02:26:05] Nah, I'm sorry man. It does raise the question. I mean, they obviously like... We got TikTok and shit now, dude. Like we gotta go, man. They fixed Connery's, uh, bullet wounds, right? But it's like, by feeding him the water, is he now... Does he live forever? No. Or since he left... He's like, got the picture on his desk of his dead dad. This was Forky's question. No, you don't live forever just by drinking from the grail one time. You gotta stay there. You gotta stay there. You gotta stay there. You gotta stay there. Oh, and it's not just you drink it once and you stay there. You gotta go.

[02:26:33] And so that's the kind of, you know, poisoned chalice thing of like, Yay, I can live forever. Yeah, you can live forever in this room. Do you like cups? No. Living a grail knight's life. Yeah, this room has cups in it. Not so life at all. It's cup room. Do you like anything but cups? Does he jerk off into every cup? Yes, yes. Okay. Guys, that's a little sacrilegious. To your point... Do you think it's a little sacrilegious actually? Are you gonna jerk off into the holy grail? It's just a wee bit sacrilegious. To your point about it feeling like Spielberg doesn't really give a shit about the grail,

[02:27:02] do you think they were all pissed that they had already blown knowledge was the real treasure? That it feels like this movie is building to some sort of line? Illumination always struck me as a very weird line. Both in that it's a little soft and there's so many tie-ins that have like, Holy Blood, Holy Grail has been written. Da Vinci Code isn't out yet, but like this idea that the Holy Grail ties into the Illuminati is out there and it feels like illumination is a weird... What'd you get out of it?

[02:27:31] It feels like they're backed into a corner of like, how do we not double beat the ending of the last one? But it's like the end... That line doesn't make a ton of sense in Temple of Doom versus what's going on in that movie. Whereas in this, it's like what you want him or Connery to say is something like, no, the grail doesn't matter. It's like this. It's what we know and it's what we care about and the friends we made along the way. There's an literal 700 year old man there that they just ignore dealing with.

[02:27:59] Either way though, just to be clear, this is all nitpicky fun things at the end. This movie rules. And the Grail Knight's one of the greatest characters of all time. The Grail Knight is... That's what we're all saying. It's a fun little mini movie. Like, it really does feel like a point and click adventure to me. This sort of like... In the best way. In a really great way. How old do you think the Grail Knight was when his dick could no longer get arched? I don't know. When did he stop jerking off in the cups? Like, when was that even off the table?

[02:28:26] Like, does drinking from the Grail make your dick stay young? Well, I also... My favorite thing is... Is it the original Blue 2? Blue 2. Keep me to it. Blue 2. My thing is also, he's in his armor. He could have taken it off, right? But he's in his armor. He like walks up to Indy and Indy's like, what? And like, he falls over. Indy doesn't even really push him. And he's like, anyway, you beat me. So, uh, like, you know, like, he's so eagerly like, oh, like, yeah, that,

[02:28:54] that counts as single combat BTW and I want to go. What do you think the Grail Knight wants? Like, he wants to sprint out there and like get one or two last things in before he crumbles into dust. He's like, thank you. You're taking over. Here's my sword. That's a good question. The second he like crosses the seal, is it like, hey, by the way, dude, you have like 40 minutes left to live. Or does he get like three days to just go party? Yeah. Does he end up having like a scent of a woman weekend? Does he want to go do Molly? No, he rents a limo.

[02:29:24] I think not because of the rules, just because it's like, you are 700 years. Yeah. Maybe not. Maybe he gets a few days. I don't think the same thing happens to him that happened to Kurt Veers. No, no, no, no. Veers is being like punished for his folly. Yes. Like that's like a... Veers gets turned into like tales from the crypt. He gets turned into a crypt. That shit rocked me as a nine year old and I never forgot the scent of memory. Well, the hair growing is great, obviously, like as the first. Mm-hmm. And then you cut to him. Her freaking out rocks. Yeah.

[02:29:53] Because she literally wanted this to happen and nonetheless is like, what the hell? How do you guys feel as her Nazi outfit is smoking hot, right? She looks really good. Yeah. I have less of a take on this than you guys. Did you see R... Chris keeps staring us back. Chris, did you see RRR? RRR? RRR? RRR? I know. I clearly did that. A Hollywood epic of a couple of years ago. If it was... If it came out since Cal was born, I almost definitely... Okay.

[02:30:19] She is in that playing basically the older version of this character, right? Like horrible colonialist woman. I'd like to think with Grail Knight that after this all goes down, he grabs a bottle of champagne that he's been holding onto. And then like a streamer comes down that says happy retirement and balloons fall down from the ceiling. He gets a watch. He gets a bunch of like novelty greeting cards over the hill too old to count. Exactly.

[02:30:49] He just sadly takes a swig out of the bottle. Yeah. And that's that. They give him a gold watch. And he's off. He moves into the Margaritaville intentional housing community. Yeah. So is everything about Indiana Jones better if this movie ends with that sequence, they leave, get on the horses, ride into the sunset, Spielberg just absolutely... Again, just kind of being like, pfff, you just do that. Best shot. Cool shot. And then that's it.

[02:31:18] And by the way, what I love about it... I know Crystal Skull. It goes on... Yeah, I think so. It goes on for so long. It's one of those things as they're riding off into the sunset and the silhouettes. It's so beautiful. You're like, oh, I'm like conditioned from movies of like at some point this will fade to black as the credits play. The shot goes on for like six minutes. It's a real kind of like... You see them get so tiny. Yeah. It is a good part of the film. I will say like, I don't... Not to bring it back to something divisive, but it's because these are this sort of like

[02:31:45] old school serial style pulpy adventure. It's very, very easy to ignore the ones you don't like as much. I agree. But that's why I think it's silly. Star Wars, which obviously is connected, has this lore and this mythology and this religion. But that would only be true if they had continued to make an indie every sort of like five to six years instead of like, now we wait 17 years or whatever, or 19 years, however long. You know, Crystal Skull comes out. The weight of expectation is far too large. It has to be about it. That's the problem. It's a legacy guy.

[02:32:15] Both Crystal Skull and Dial of Destiny are like, how do we make a movie that responds to the weight of expectations of Indiana Jones' back and dealing with the advanced age and what is a proper ending for him? There's just a moment where in the mid 90s, Spielberg should have either just been like, fine, I'll make a fourth one. Like we should just keep doing this or done what he did with Jurassic Park where he's like, I did three. I, you know, I did plenty. Like someone else can do that. But there's the thing we're not acknowledging here, which is that like Ford just always wanted to play the character again.

[02:32:45] Like Ford wouldn't drop it. He wouldn't drop it, but they wouldn't. The opposite of his opinion on Hansel does. It kept being like, please, please, please guys. Yeah. But the problem is Lucas gets bogged down in starting with the prequels. Spielberg gets bogged down in being like a studio mogul who makes Schindler's List and Oscar winning shit. I would still argue like one of the heartbreaking things about Star Wars is the misses. Like. Well, with Star Wars, it's a woven together saga.

[02:33:11] But I think, and because of that, like my son's going to grow up with a Star Wars where the misses do take away some of the magic that I got to grow up with. I do not think that Indiana Jones' misses take away the magic of Raiders or Last No, I think the two sequels being so far away does mean you can kind of keep it hermetic. Even Temple. Even Temple's flaws. Right. Sure. I could sit down. Raiders is, or Crusade is rather.

[02:33:39] And some of this, obviously I have such clear, you know, personal memories of being in the theater with my dad. But, has there ever been a time where Last Crusade or Raiders of the Lost Ark is on cable and you don't stop and watch for at least five or six minutes? No. Like it's one of those. It is. Always and forever. Yeah. Yeah. And nothing can ding that. And I think it is because like, you know, they, they, the, the guys who wrote the Pirates of the Caribbean movies talk about when that first movie was such a surprise success and

[02:34:08] they were like, Disney wants a trilogy. The first question they asked themselves was, are we Star Wars or Indiana Jones? And I think a lot of franchises these days make the mistake of being like, we have to be Star Wars. We have to try to weave an intentional epic, a narrative that feels like it was planned from the beginning, all these things. And there's like a real benefit to being like Indiana Jones, make it up as you go along. Just have fun. Play around, you know?

[02:34:33] Um, and I think that does help its legacy where you're just like, there's nothing any amount of other Indiana Jones shit can do that will ever damage the earlier films. Like you're like, it probably would have been better if they never made a fourth or fifth movie. But I also don't think they really take away from anything. Whereas not to talk about stars, but their shit and rise of Skywalker. I'm like, it leads up to that. That does sort of color other shit for me.

[02:35:00] You know, as much as the movies like themselves are objects that can't be damaged. There's these moments that do get like you watch and or, and you sit there and you're like, oh, the way that they are looking back at the original movie. And this series actually shows you like, no, this had this world had turned into a fascist dystopian nightmare. And then you think about how Rogue One leads into it and you go like, man, people had gotten to the point where they're like killing their own allies for making noise to make sure they don't get killed. And that's so grim and it's so dark.

[02:35:30] And then you think about the foolishness of a teenage kid going, oh, the Death Star, let's say it's not much worse than shooting out a womp rat back home. And you're like, you needed a kid that naive to be able to pull this off. And in a hopeless world, everyone must have, and or does such a good job of getting it back. And it's like the grimness of the audacity of even having hope. Um, and some of those attempts at Star Wars do get it back, which is why Last Jedi making Luke cynical is an absolute betrayal. I don't want to talk about the box.

[02:36:00] David, how'd this movie do at the box office? So May Memorial Day 1989. It's the, like we said, the, uh, to be clear, George Lucas, that was his entire plan. Guess doing it. A bunch of hands. I had, I wanted to avoid it completely, but you set it up. All cynicism curdles. You had to do it. You had to say this. No idealism lasts. Even Tintin and the Picarus, the final completed Tintin novel, right? The graphic novel, whatever. I don't love that you pointed at my hairline when you said Tintin.

[02:36:28] Uh, specifically the hairline, not even at you. You know, Tintin is always a fairly idealistic person, right? And it's only in literally in pretty much in the last few books, you're starting to see like a bit, the slightest edge with him, but it's only Tintin and the Picarus, which is the final book Harry Jay completed before he died. Where Tintin suddenly is not wearing his plus fours, the pants he used to wear. He's wearing longer pants. His short pants. Yeah, he's wearing like sort of flared pants. I love you making direct eye contact and screwing me on Tintin. I want you to hear about Tintin.

[02:36:58] This is you giving, handing me my ass after years of me tormenting me. Right. And Tintin and the Picarus is about, they go to this, uh, sort of fictional Latin American country that's been in the books before. And their friend, General Alcazar, who they've had adventures with before, he's been, he's on the outs. He's become this kind of guerrilla fighter. They help him take over, uh, and kick out the sort of the mean general who's in charge. Right.

[02:37:23] But the, the book begins with them landing like the plane and you sort of see the city and there's like a cop spinning, uh, you know, uh, what are you, a bat, you know, whatever. Billy club. Billy club. Right. And then in the end of the book, when they're leaving, you see the same cop. He's just got a different uniform on and there's sort of Hergé's cynicism abounds a little bit. And Tintin is more cynical of this. Like we're not, we're not really doing good here. You know what I mean? Creator cynicism or? Yes. The creator.

[02:37:52] But you see it in Tintin for the first time. It's starting to bleed in. Yes. And it's so fascinating to me. I think I'm like, I think I get the point you're making. Right. Any idealistic character. It sounds like what you're saying is that General Alcazar is the Fisto of Tintin. I mean, I, General Alcazar is a character I truly adore. So sure. Yeah. So I'll, I'll go with that. But also to just bring this all together, right? Like I love the Tintin movie. You love the Tintin movie. Spielberg made his Tintin movie. He did. Yeah. That is. That's more classic Tintin of like, he's the, he's the sweet kid who, you know.

[02:38:22] But also in direct relation to this movie, I'm like, that's just Spielberg having fun. That movie is not about anything. Not really. It is about less than the books are. Yeah. No. Yeah, for sure. It's mostly just like. He's still making shit and him being like, look at what I can do with new technology. And I think you put that next to Last Crusade and Last Crusade's got a little more on its mind than the Tintin movie as a text. Um, yeah. Last Crusade is, is quite a bit more. I should say not even a little more. Yeah.

[02:38:51] I just think at this point Spielberg has more depth. He does. Oh, I just wanted to say, uh, wet chonker. Uh, the actor's name is JJ Hardy. There we go. Yeah. Of course that's that guy's name. Yeah. Um, so it opens number one, Griffin. 37 million dollars. Memorial Day weekend. For the four day. Amazing. Can you now please get me the name, individual names of all 2,000 wet mice? They're right. I'll put it up.

[02:39:16] Number two at the box office, Griffin, is a comedy from like a duo who did a lot of movies together, but I think this is seen as maybe their worst. I think it's also their last. Is it another you? No. No. What's that? No. Okay. So prior and wilder. Okay. Okay. It is prior. Right. Another you is their true last. It's their second. So this one is see no evil, hear no evil. I feel like a movie Ben likes, or you would watch a lot as a child. Obsessed. Yes.

[02:39:41] That was weirdly this movie that I feel like I caught on cable TV enough times that then I ended up having it on VHS. I brought comedy. And would re-watch it a bunch of times. With the premise of what if one guy was blind and one guy was dead. And they get involved in like a murder mystery or whatever. Right. Yeah. But it's not, I haven't seen it. It's not well regarded, right? The scene is a bad movie. Well, because a lot of the comedy is based around their disabilities. Sure. Yeah. Which the actors, of course, do not have. Right.

[02:40:11] Another you is the one though that is like truly dying. That's 1991. And that was. Prior must be really. Yeah. He's not in good shape. Yeah. Number three, The Box Office. A film we mentioned on this episode several times. Inspiration or, you know, not inspiration. Heartwarming drama. Field of Dreams? Field of Dreams. Oh wow. Yeah. Is doing great at The Box Office. Kind of like a little engine that could type movie. And will sort of sleep walk its way to a surprise.

[02:40:40] Best picture nomination. Yeah. Uh, number four at The Box Office. Geth it. Geth. Are you just leaving Geth? I legitimately am about to miss my son's school. Yeah. You gotta go. I'm a father. I gotta give you this. What's that? I have long promised to send something for Cal, your son. Oh, that's so nice. And... You did send it. You sent a Kit Fisto onesie when he was born. I did. A couple times I've asked for address to send it, but now I have it.

[02:41:09] Um, I'm so sorry to have to run, but I've moved over. I got so much shit about trying to keep the train on time. And now, like, Geth has a hard out. I should have fun. You guys are having fun. You crazy idiots. What is this? You want me to open this on mic? I think so. A gift for my son? I think so. I know. It's also good to remind, um, your viewers that I'm not a monster. I do have a life. You do. And you're a dear friend. You really have to stop looking at Reddit, Chris. Like, 99% of people do not think you're a monster. I know, of course. I've also met so many Blank Check fans.

[02:41:38] Like, I'll go on the road and they come to stand-up shows of mine and they are lovely. Yes. In person. Great to hear. Yeah. Absolutely love that. There are two items in here. Oh my goodness. And these are for your son. We've got a Star Wars battle Jedi vs. Darth Sidious. This is specifically a box set of the Jedi Wrecking Crew. It is your favorite moment. It is the three guys showing up to fight Sidious. This is really amazing. The other item. Which I couldn't believe existed.

[02:42:08] A lot of Transformers. Dude! A Kit Fisto Transformer? It is a robot Kit Fisto that transforms into Kit Fisto Starfighter. That's so fucking sick. It just feels like your son's at Star Wars age now. He's at Star Wars age and Transformers age. I think here we go. He's Delta 7 Aspirite class. I'm truly touched. Thank you. You're welcome. Sorry to pay out of here. No, it's all good. Thanks for doing the admin. Anything to plug? You're doing your new show at UCB? That show at UCB hosted by Chris Gethard.

[02:42:37] It's selling out months in advance. I'm not sure why, but I'm very flattered. Live in New York, but also live stream tickets available. You can get live streaming tickets for- Yeah, it's the last Wednesday of every month. Beautiful Anonymous. Still going strong. It's a good look at humanity, one human at a time. Thanks everybody. We'll drop links in the episode description for all that. And Geth is running with a box full of Kit Fisto toys. Send Helly and your son might love. Thank you guys. Sorry to pay out. No, no. Did we finish the five? Number four at the box office.

[02:43:08] Cult movie. Not really a big hit at the time. People forget. I mean, it was a whatever. Okay. It was a reasonable hit. Hmm. But has become quite a cult movie. Has become quite a cult movie. Give me a jump. Action? Action. I guess. It was recently remade. It was recently remade. Yeah. It's kind of like an action drama. Hmm. How to describe it? It's, it's, Wikipedia describes it as an action film. What studio distributed the picture?

[02:43:37] Oh, United Artists. United Artists. It's a silver film. Joel Silverfilm. It's not Red Dawn. Nope. But you've got the right actor. It's a Swayze. Mm-hmm. Huh. Uh. What is it? Well, it's not Point Break. That's later. It's the Swayze movie that's a big cult movie that just got remade. Oh, Roadhouse. Yep. Right. What do you think of Roadhouse? Uh, yeah. I get it. Okay. It's never been mine, but I'm like, I understand the cult around it. Do you like Roadhouse? Hellfuck. Yeah, of course. Yeah.

[02:44:07] Fun. Mm-hmm. Yeah, man. He was a philosophy major. Yeah. But now he's the freaking best bouncer all around. He rips out throats. Yeah, dude. Number five at the box office. Mm-hmm. Is a film that I, uh, I think I've described on this podcast. It's a very specific film. Okay. It's a major movie star. Mm-hmm. Uh, who often would direct himself, but this is, uh, one of the ones where he's being directed by one of his guys. It's a Clint? It's a Clint movie. Is it like Firefox?

[02:44:37] Not Firefox. Clint directed Firefox. Okay. But it's in that zone? It's not Iger Sanction. That's earlier? It's Clint also directed Iger Sanction, which is an amazing movie. I can't remember which ones he didn't direct. Uh, well, I'll say this. I described it, I think on this show as what if Clint, uh, Eastwood played Gene Parmesan. Mm-hmm. Because it's one of those movies where you're like, it's about like kind of a skip tracer, right? He's this guy who, who like- Is it like Bronco Billy? What is this? Not Bronco Billy. I don't know what that movie is about. Clint also directed that. That's a really good movie. Goddammit.

[02:45:06] Uh, skip tracer, you know, so like a guy who like basically finds people. Yeah. And the premise of the movie is like, he's really good at like donning disguises to catch people and like, he is not like- They are Gene Parmesan level. Is it called The Blank? No, it's called Pink Cadillac. Oh. I never knew that's what that movie was about. Yup. I guess you've told me it's not. It's a Buddy Van Horn movie. Buddy Van Horn also directed any way you can. Mm-hmm. And the Deadpool, uh, Pink Cadillac opening at number five.

[02:45:34] So I think probably not a bigger success for him. Yeah. Only made $12 million. Okay. But it's Clint and Bernadette Peters. Yeah. A big two. Yup. You've also got K9. Mm-hmm. The, that's the Jim Belushi dog movie. Right. Outgrossing Turner and Hooch. No. There you go. Uh, you've got Pet Sematary, the original adaptation of Pet Sematary that is pretty good. Yeah. Solid movie. Uh, pretty scary. Uh, directed by Mary Lambert. That's a well-made film. You have a film, uh, that Ben likes a lot.

[02:46:03] A little movie called Major League. Well, well, well. And Bob Buecher just died. Uh, you know, Bob Buecher? The announcer? Oh, yeah. Bob Buecher is a famous announcer, but he also was really funny. And so he's the announcer in Major League and he has two of my favorite line deliveries ever. One, of course, is just a bit outside, which is so funny. Kind of a proto Fred Willard and best in show performance. Uh, but I, I just, it just always gets me where he's like, you know, saying like setting up like, all right. And it's all stakes on the line. And then the other team gets a hint and he goes, ah, shit.

[02:46:32] It just always makes me laugh. Can we do Major League? Yes, we can. We can just do it. Yeah, we can just do it. We can do whatever the fuck we want. We can do whatever we want. We're in charge. We have no bosses. We always were kind of like, oh, well, maybe we'll do David S. Warren's like, we're not going to do that. We're not the directors. Although, maybe we do David S. Warren. No, come on. We're finally going to knock out some David S. Warren this year. So I think we could do Major Leagues 1 and 2 on our Patreon. Do we do back to the minors?

[02:47:01] Yeah, we have to. It's not too good. They're, Bacula. Bacula. Haysbert. Haysbert and Bernstein, I think, are the two holdovers. From the original two. Yeah. Is Major League 2 any good? I love Major League 2. Absolutely. That was the one I preferred. Well, that's a crazy. But that might have just been, it was. I actually kind of prefer it too. Why? It was even more regular rotation on like Comedy Central. I don't know what I think it's that.

[02:47:30] I saw it so many more times. Truly, I have cried at Major League 2 many, many times. I like the arc of Wild Thing trying to go normal. Yeah. And I find the moment at the end where he goes full Wild Thing. Well, then I think we need to watch Major League this year. Then we'll do Major League. Yeah. Number 9, Rain Man, which has been in the box office for like six months or whatever. The highest grossing film of the year before. I think so. Is still out. Yeah. And then number 10 of the box office is a movie called Scandal.

[02:48:00] It looks like a sort of erotic British. Oh no, it's a British. It's about the Profumo affair. Very famous British sex scandal. Uh, stars John Hurt and uh, Joanne, Joanne Wally, the uh, wife of Val Kilmer as Christine Keeler. That's the box office game. We're done with Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade. Our guest had to leave. Yeah. Box full of Fisto. Uh, with a box full of Fisto. And we, we... I have a pie from Chris. Yeah, he gave you a pie. He gave you a pie.

[02:48:29] Uh, in uh, celebration of your uh, your, I was, I was about to say growing family, but grown family. It is now reached its maximum size. So tired and hungry. Great. So the episode's over. The episode is over. Yeah. I love this movie. Thanks you all for listening. It's a good movie. It's a good movie. And it's also, as much as Spielberg is, it's time for him to put aside childish things. He then makes two kind of ungainly flawed films before Jurassic Park. Yeah.

[02:48:59] Next week, we'll talk about always a very weird kind of total miss for him in terms of public, uh, you know, response, uh, the box office and critics and all of it. Uh, with our friend Richard Lawson returning to the show. Um, yes. Kind of his major league too, growing up a movie he watched a weird number of times. And over on the Patreon, we are talking Star Trek, the next generation and the next movie we are talking about is Star Trek Nemesis. We're wrapping it up.

[02:49:28] To the end of that. Stuart Baird's Star Trek Nemesis. Should we say what we're doing next after that? With Tom Hardy as evil. Well, we have Galaxy Quest. Oh, great. So then we'll save it. But we're doing Galaxy Quest after Nemesis. Great. So like, it's still a few more weeks of that. Yeah. Cool. Uh, thank you all for listening. And as always, I sent my manager the draft day link. She responded, we'll look into it. And I just want to on the record say, I predict nothing will ever come of this.

[02:49:56] You predict they will not look into it. I'm predicting this is the last I hear about it. Blank Check with Griffin and David is hosted by Griffin Newman and David Sims. Our executive producer is me, Ben Hosley. Our creative producer is Marie Barty Salinas. And our associate producer is AJ McKeon. This show is mixed and edited by AJ McKeon and Alan Smithy. Research by JJ Burch.

[02:50:25] Our theme song is by Lane Montgomery in the Great American Novel. With additional music by Alex Mitchell. Artwork by Joe Bowen, Olly Moss, and Pat Reynolds. Our production assistant is Minnick. Special thanks to David Cho, Jordan Fish, and Nate Patterson for their production help. Head over to BlankCheckPod.com for links to all of the real nerdy shit. Join our Patreon, Blank Check Special Features, for exclusive franchise commentaries and bonus episodes. Follow us on social at BlankCheckPod.

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